Did Trump and Xi get what they wanted? | The Global Story

0:00 Has Donald Trump's China visit left

0:03 his relationship with Xi Jinping stronger or weaker?

0:07 The US president has often sounded like this on China.

0:12 We have been ripped off by China.

0:15 An evacuation of wealth like no country has ever seen before.

0:19 In Beijing this week, he sounded more like this.

0:23 Here he is speaking to the Chinese leader Xi Jinping.

0:26 We're going to have a fantastic future together.

0:31 Such respect for China, the job you've done.

0:34 You're a great leader.

0:35 I say it to everybody.

0:36 You're a great leader.

0:37 Does Xi Jinping feel the same?

0:40 From the BBC, I'm Tristan Redman in Paris,

0:43 and this is the global story on YouTube.

0:50 And we're joined today, I'm very pleased to say,

0:53 by the BBC's China correspondent Laura Bicker.

0:56 Laura, so good to have you with us.

0:58 Nice to be with you.

1:00 Nice to be with you.

1:00 I mean, it's such a quiet time here in China.

1:04 Absolutely.

1:05 I mean, you've had a you've had a What's it been?

1:07 48 hours now?

1:09 Since since the president arrived?

1:12 Yeah, we've been quite a whirlwind.

1:14 Lots of pomp, lots of pageantry.

1:16 Well, what have been the big moments for you?

1:18 Talk us through the scenes.

1:21 So, let's start with that handshake.

1:22 14 seconds.

1:23 14 seconds for a handshake.

1:25 It didn't just feel like an ordinary greeting.

1:28 It felt like kind of almost a symbol of global power.

1:31 You had these two leaders coming together.

1:33 You had the handshake.

1:34 Donald Trump gave him a little pat on the the hand.

1:37 And then even as the hands separated, there was the pat on the shoulder.

1:41 It did seem that that was the moment.

1:43 Here we have the two leading economic powers in the world.

1:48 The two leaders of the world superpowers together.

1:52 Let's see what's going to happen.

1:53 So, that set the scene.

1:54 And then we had this military parade.

1:57 So, we had this honor guard um which welcomes many visitors,

2:01 but they even had uh a 21-gun salute

2:04 for the United States during the national anthem.

2:07 And uh President Trump was invited to inspect the honor guard.

2:11 So, the two leaders walk the red carpet.

2:15 But as they do so, there is a moment that just

2:18 sits with me every time because the these honor guards,

2:21 they are highly trained and their eyes

2:23 track the leaders [music] absolutely in sync.

2:28 And then as they came down past all the soldiers,

2:31 they came to this crowd of cheering children.

2:34 And they're all there waving their American and Chinese flags.

2:38 And Donald Trump reveled in it.

2:40 You could see he paused twice to wave to the children.

2:43 And I think when it comes to that kind of welcome, it sets the tone.

2:47 It was designed, it was carefully

2:50 choreographed to flatter the US president before

2:53 they even headed into the Great Hall of the People and started those talks.

2:57 Then there was uh the kind of difference

2:59 in tone between President Xi and Donald Trump.

3:02 You you mentioned there what Donald Trump had to say,

3:04 but President Xi started it off very friendly, very cordial.

3:08 But they're very careful with their language here in China.

3:11 President Trump, on the other hand, his remarks sounded unscripted and he,

3:15 you know, really lavished praise on his host.

3:18 For someone who's built his political brand on being tough on China,

3:24 watching that exchange was very,

3:26 very interesting because here we have a a Donald

3:29 Trump who was there almost sounding deferential.

3:33 And for, you know, if you're sitting talking

3:36 to analysts a lot of the time here in China,

3:39 and we're all looking at the balance of power and wondering if it's shifting.

3:43 And I think when I spoke to analysts even before this visit,

3:46 what they were saying is what they were watching for is for the first time

3:51 the US United States is beginning to acknowledge

3:54 they are dealing with a near peer in China.

3:57 When Donald Trump came to the first time in 2017,

4:00 he came to a very different China than

4:02 the one he's been in for the last 48 hours.

4:05 I have to ask you about the banquet because one of the things

4:07 that's really stood out to me uh was these incredibly elaborate place settings.

4:14 There was a table which appeared to have uh a sort of miniature uh park,

4:20 lake, pond with birds in the middle of it.

4:24 Um is this a thing in China?

4:27 You mean you don't have a table at home

4:29 with some some uh birds in the middle of it?

4:32 Uh actually birds are a sign of prosperity here in China.

4:35 Um it used to it used to be a sign uh if

4:38 you owned a bird that you were prosperous and you were well-to-do.

4:42 And so they're a sign of good luck, which is why they appear in so much uh

4:46 Chinese kind of uh embroidery and on table settings.

4:50 Uh so yeah, I mean what a what a place to have a banquet.

4:54 You know, when they were led in and you could see these huge tables.

4:57 These rooms are cavernous.

5:00 But it for dinner, I know I know what you want to hear.

5:04 You want to know what they were eating, right?

5:05 So for dinner there was, of course, Beijing roast duck.

5:09 What else are you going to serve the US president here in Beijing?

5:13 It's delicious.

5:14 Come and try it.

5:15 Uh there was also beef ribs.

5:17 Strangely, there was also tiramisu for dessert.

5:20 Now, I couldn't work out whether that's maybe someone's favorite dessert,

5:23 but there was tiramisu for dessert.

5:25 But it was It's definitely an unexpected

5:27 appearance from the tiramisu, isn't it isn't it?

5:31 [gasps] I think watching Chinese media is also always quite interesting

5:33 because Donald Trump was trending um on Chinese social media.

5:38 And they were all One of the things obviously Chinese people

5:40 are really eager to know is what's the president going to eat.

5:43 What they noticed was that a lot of flavors are a lot milder,

5:47 maybe very well-known Chinese dishes.

5:49 So, there was a feeling that perhaps they were trying to tone

5:52 down a lot of the flavors of the food for the Western palate.

5:57 Um, so there was no hot pot for instance

6:00 on the menu with duck blood intestines and very, very hot peppers.

6:04 Um, but it was all kind of um,

6:06 beef ribs, uh, roast duck, um, stewed beef and buns.

6:12 So, there were some baozi.

6:13 Uh, so these kind of traditional Chinese dishes,

6:17 but not ones that have the real punch with a flavor.

6:21 I mean, it it it does all sound very good.

6:24 Um, I have to ask you about the etiquette of toasting because um,

6:28 there is some video that I saw of Donald Trump raising a glass.

6:31 It looks like it has white wine or maybe champagne in it,

6:35 um, clinking glasses and then it looks like he's sipping from it.

6:39 We obviously don't know whether he he he actually

6:41 swallowed any of what was in in the glass.

6:44 Um, but it does seem unusual to me to be asking,

6:47 you know, maybe the world's most noted teetotaler uh, to cheers with you.

6:52 What's the etiquette on that and how important are these toasts?

6:55 I think when it comes to toast, so even with the etiquette, um,

6:59 that there's there's even more to it although that obviously wasn't in view.

7:03 When you come to clinking, you've got to the most senior person in the room

7:08 and the most junior person in the room.

7:09 So, your glass, if you're senior, your glass stays up and the junior person has

7:13 to clink below the rim of the glass, not above.

7:17 Uh, these are important little details here.

7:20 Uh, but it when it comes to the toast, it may have been apple juice.

7:24 It may have you So, there's, you know,

7:26 but in terms of toasting, in terms of eating together,

7:30 these are important rituals uh, not just in China,

7:33 but across much much of East Asia.

7:35 What was the fundamental hope on each side for what would

7:39 emerge from this meeting and did they get anywhere near achieving it?

7:44 So, both sides had very different priorities,

7:47 but let's start with the big overriding issue, the war in Iran.

7:50 Now, before these talks started,

7:54 I think it would the focus was always hoping to be on trade.

7:57 Remember, we've had a year of a trade

7:59 war where these tit-for-tat tariffs raised over 100%.

8:04 That ended in a trade truce in October when the two leaders met in South Korea.

8:09 Now, the hope was that they could continue that trade truce

8:12 and it does seem that we are hearing that is a possibility.

8:17 Um so, at least we have that, but the overarching

8:20 theme of all of this has been the war in Iran, the war in Iran, the war in Iran.

8:25 And it does seem that every single question and every single answer

8:28 that Donald Trump has given has been on the Middle East conflict.

8:31 Why?

8:32 Because China can play a key role.

8:36 Beijing is a key ally of Tehran.

8:40 Beijing buys most of Iranian oil, about 80% of Iran's oil.

8:45 Beijing is also an ally dating back decades for Tehran.

8:50 There has been a hope within the US administration that President Xi could

8:54 use that economic and diplomatic leverage

8:57 to nudge Tehran towards the negotiating table.

9:01 Now, before he took off and arrived here in Beijing,

9:04 Donald Trump said, "I don't need China's help." Despite those assurances,

9:09 both Marco Rubio and other officials have been saying

9:13 publicly that they hoped President Xi would weigh in.

9:16 Now, within the last few hours,

9:17 I can tell you that we have had a statement from the Chinese Foreign Ministry,

9:21 once again calling for a cease-fire,

9:23 once again saying that the war the conflict needed to come to an end,

9:27 but they have come the closest that I've seen

9:29 to admitting that they are working behind the scenes.

9:32 They say they are working tirelessly to try to bring an end to this conflict.

9:37 It is in China's interest.

9:39 I think there are many reasons for this.

9:41 First of all, China depends on the global economy to survive.

9:45 In terms of exports, that is what's propping up this economy.

9:50 And before, if I'd been just kind of Beijing-based,

9:53 I would have said to you, "Look,

9:55 you know, the war in Iran, diplomatically, politically,

9:58 it's a bit of a win for President Xi." But on the ground,

10:00 it is hurting many factories and many

10:03 producers of things like textiles and plastics.

10:06 So, in terms of getting its economy moving, they need the war in Iran to to end.

10:10 And of course, China depends on the Strait of Hormuz to get most of its energy.

10:14 About 45% of its oil comes through the Strait of Hormuz.

10:17 So, when it comes to that kind of calculation, Beijing will want to step in.

10:23 And it does seem that that has been a discussion,

10:25 and it does seem that they both agree Iran should not have nuclear weapons,

10:30 and that they want the Strait of Hormuz opened.

10:32 So, we'll see how from here how much Beijing

10:35 or how willing Beijing is to wade into that conflict.

10:38 But I think for many analysts,

10:40 what they'll say is the fact that this meeting happened at all is a win.

10:44 Were the words that Xi Jinping used about Donald

10:47 Trump as warm as those that Trump addressed to Xi?

10:53 The words that President Xi used are the ones that I've heard a lot.

10:57 He's talking about the great power competition, how they should be partners,

11:02 not rivals, how it should be win-win competition between the two superpowers.

11:07 So, I think when it comes to President Xi's words,

11:09 they were the same that I'd heard many, many times before.

11:13 It was very, as I said, carefully scripted.

11:15 But what we didn't hear on the tape was

11:18 when we got a read out from Chinese state media,

11:21 President Xi warned Donald Trump and the United States

11:25 that when it came to the issue of Taiwan,

11:27 that is where these two superpowers could collide.

11:30 That is where he said there was a danger of conflict and clashes.

11:34 Now, we've heard this kind of language before,

11:37 but to hear it um in this context and know

11:40 that President Xi said these words to Donald Trump in the room,

11:44 that I thought, considering Donald Trump's tone at the start of the talks,

11:48 I thought that was very, very interesting.

11:50 So, I'm not I don't think the tone was as warm,

11:53 but President Xi is more kind of like a professor.

11:56 And you you saw this um with many of the events.

12:00 He enjoys apparently giving history lessons,

12:03 and he will really have taken pleasure in showing

12:07 Donald Trump around the 15th century Temple of Heaven.

12:10 This is a former sacrificial altar where emperors

12:13 used to go and pray for very good harvests.

12:16 Uh and I think when it comes to this tour and when it comes to this summit,

12:21 President Xi has been careful every single step.

12:25 And I think Donald Trump was unusually quiet

12:28 on the issue of Taiwan when it came to the cameras.

12:32 Um there was a bit of a scramble with the pill feed,

12:34 and a couple of reporters started shouting out to Donald

12:37 Trump at the photo opportunity at the Temple of Heaven,

12:40 "Did you talk about Taiwan?

12:41 Did you talk about Taiwan?" Donald Trump said, "Oh, it's been good discussions.

12:45 China is beautiful." Someone pushed again,

12:47 "Did you talk about Taiwan?" And then Donald Trump stayed silent.

12:51 He knows this is a contentious issue,

12:54 and he knows that he also it has to be careful with his language.

12:59 So, I think when it came to watching the dynamic

13:02 between these two leaders and how it changed in China,

13:05 different to how Donald Trump is when he's traveling in the United States,

13:08 that was very interesting.

13:10 Laura, let's talk a little bit about uh body language.

13:14 In the past on the global story, we've spent quite a bit of time

13:17 talking about uh how Xi Jinping manages handshakes.

13:21 How would you look at uh the body

13:22 language on this trip overall between the two men?

13:26 I think when I've seen them together,

13:29 uh uh I thought when especially the Temple of Heaven,

13:33 I thought it looked like Donald Trump

13:35 was definitely more deferential to his host.

13:38 And that is because President Xi, you know, he's president of China.

13:42 Um he's, you know, and Donald Trump is basically on his turf.

13:46 But there was definitely a lot of kind of nodding, a lot of kind of to the side.

13:51 Um Donald Trump was aware that he was definitely the guest in this country.

13:56 And President Xi is the leader.

13:58 And even he says that a lot, you know, you're a great leader,

14:00 you're a great leader,

14:01 that you've been a great host, China's a beautiful country.

14:04 Very aware that this kind of language helps perhaps

14:09 when it goes in when he goes into talks.

14:12 So I I did think that as well as the tone of the language,

14:15 the tone of the body language was also slightly deferential from Donald Trump.

14:19 President Xi is very hard to read.

14:23 His his facial expressions, his body language barely changes.

14:27 He stays in the same position for every

14:30 single leader and for every kind of shot.

14:33 He doesn't give anything away.

14:35 I think Donald Trump has said in the past,

14:37 especially in Busan, oh, he's a tough negotiator, he's a tough negotiator.

14:41 President Trump and President Xi are two

14:43 opposites when it comes to body language

14:45 and when it comes to the careful choreography and when it comes to scripting.

14:49 Mr.

14:49 Trump is a showman.

14:51 He likes to show off in front of the cameras.

14:53 He likes to kind of um ad-lib.

14:56 He likes to kind of do whether it's his own little dance,

15:00 his own little signature moves.

15:02 President Xi's signature move is very staid, um very kind of professorial.

15:08 He doesn't stray from the kind of staid uh leader that he believes China wants.

15:18 And he's unwilling often to kind of even

15:23 stray from the path of any kind of script, any kind of choreography.

15:30 So, that's why I say they're totally opposites.

15:32 I think on this occasion as well, I thought I mean,

15:35 I thought President Trump really was uncharacteristically quiet.

15:39 Now, I could see that in his body language as well.

15:42 I think it'll be interesting to see what's announced at the end

15:44 of this and if anything comes out from any of the background calls.

15:47 I mean, cuz one of the things as a a correspondent China is also a peak.

15:52 It's also difficult and as you say the thing

15:54 the only things we have are the readouts, the body language, and the pictures.

15:59 Um so, it's very difficult to read

16:00 into what might have gone on behind the scenes.

16:03 Well, Donald Trump may have been on Xi's turf, as you say, but he you know,

16:08 it looks like he made an effort to rectify that imbalance

16:11 in the sense that he brought his gang with him.

16:14 There were 30 CEOs uh who made the trip um along with Donald Trump.

16:19 Why so many?

16:20 Who were they and what did they achieve?

16:23 So, I think to give you the three main ones,

16:25 Boeing was the Boeing CEO was here and I think one of the reasons for that was

16:28 because they are that the US is eager for China to buy more Boeing aircraft.

16:33 And uh when it comes to that outcome,

16:36 President Trump says that China has agreed to buy buy some Boeing aircraft.

16:40 Then there was Elon Musk with his son.

16:43 Um which we were surprised to see.

16:45 Uh Elon Musk is a frequent visitor to China.

16:48 He has a massive Tesla factory uh near Shanghai.

16:52 Um and obviously when it comes to electric vehicles and vehicle sales,

16:55 China is now the leading exporter of of vehicles um around the world,

17:00 which is a real challenge to US manufacturers.

17:03 And then of course, you had the key one and this was the one

17:06 that was trending on Chinese social media

17:08 and that was the Nvidia chief um Jensen Huang.

17:10 Now, the reason he's so important is because China

17:13 is trying to push towards some kind of robotics revolution.

17:18 Artificial intelligence, humanoid robots,

17:20 these are what President Xi terms his new technological forces.

17:24 Now, I've seen this in action.

17:25 I've seen dancing robots, running robots, robots serving me my dinner.

17:30 Um uh when it comes to uh robots, I've seen them in factories.

17:34 There are more robots in Chinese factories than anywhere else in the world.

17:37 But, China's very good so far at building the the body,

17:40 but it needs help with the robot brain.

17:43 They are catching up.

17:44 So, homegrown chip suppliers here in China are catching up,

17:47 but they're not quite there yet.

17:48 China wants access to the high-end Nvidia chips,

17:51 and those have been restricted by Washington for some time.

17:55 Tru- Donald Trump kind of lifted those some of those restrictions, but not all.

17:59 So, I think when it comes to Nvidia chief,

18:01 not only do they want to sell to China, China wants to buy.

18:04 It's a case of if if Donald Trump will let him.

18:08 So, those were the kind of main chief executives I spotted,

18:10 but you obviously had um the Apple CEO, you had others here.

18:15 Many of them tech bosses, because obviously when it comes to technology,

18:18 that is something that China is racing towards

18:22 and could buy a lot of American American goods.

18:25 You alluded earlier on, very briefly we touched on the the subject of Taiwan,

18:30 which is obviously one of the big ones.

18:32 Um what if anything did we learn about the Taiwan

18:36 tensions between China and the United States on this trip?

18:40 As I said, I think the interesting thing was the warning that President Xi gave.

18:44 Um we haven't learned anything uh from the US side.

18:47 We are told that that might be to come.

18:49 Now, remember, the United States provides arms to Taiwan,

18:52 but those aid pack- aid packages have been

18:56 um kind of delayed by Donald Trump so far, perhaps ahead of this visit.

19:00 And those aid packages are something that China believes should stop.

19:05 And we do believe that President Xi has pressed

19:08 Donald Trump into trying to stop arms sales heading

19:12 to the self-governing island that Beijing claims as its

19:15 own and has not ruled out we taking by force.

19:18 So, when it comes to Taiwan,

19:19 we are still waiting to hear from the US side what was agreed if anything.

19:25 Um but there is certainly that very very

19:28 clear warning that when it comes to Taiwan,

19:30 that is where these two sides could come into conflict.

19:33 That is China's deepest, darkest red line.

19:36 How is all of this being reported uh by Chinese media?

19:41 And how are Chinese people on the ground

19:43 that you're speaking to seeing it, Laura?

19:46 I think that So, the Chinese state media newspapers this morning were plastered

19:50 with the pomp and ceremony of yesterday morning's uh kind of military parade.

19:55 Um and they had the headline,

19:57 but all the headline uh said was uh President Xi met Donald Trump.

20:02 Uh they they go into very great detail about

20:05 the Chinese side of uh the statements that are read out,

20:08 which are very long, very full of diplomatic language,

20:12 um and talked about how it may reach a new era of US uh China relations,

20:19 talked about uh the strengthening of cooperation,

20:23 of deepening uh deepening their understanding of each

20:27 other and their genuine understanding of each other.

20:30 And that is how very much how Chinese people see this.

20:34 They see it as important in terms of lowering trade tensions.

20:38 They see it as important in terms of you know,

20:40 the global um issues with regards to the war in Iran.

20:44 Uh and in terms for their terms, they see it in terms of their own pocket.

20:48 What might this mean for me?

20:49 And a lot of people have a lot of investments,

20:52 whether it's in gold or whether it's in um you know,

20:55 whether it's even money stuffed under your mattress.

20:57 They want to know that that money is going to go far.

21:03 And for that, they want one thing, and that's stability.

21:06 I think the word stability was mentioned in one

21:09 paragraph of Chinese state media about five or six times.

21:13 And I think you and I have talked about this on previous podcast.

21:15 When it comes to China,

21:16 the key thing for President Xi is stability to grow this country's economy.

21:22 And that is because when it comes to the Communist Party,

21:26 um I think when it came to the rise of the Communist Party,

21:29 remember where we were maybe just two generations ago here in China.

21:33 You had families who had were struggling to get enough to eat.

21:37 There was incredible levels of poverty.

21:40 And now two decades decades on, it really is the world's second superpower.

21:44 It has President Xi has been welcoming,

21:46 you know, countries from all over the world,

21:48 including Canada, the United Kingdom,

21:50 and Germany all e- here coming here eager to do a deal.

21:55 And so Beijing will see itself as rising.

21:58 And in order to keep doing that, the Communist Party has to ensure

22:03 that it's looking after its own people and that its people are not becoming,

22:07 you know, uh they see it as making

22:10 sure that their people are still becoming rich.

22:12 And right now there are real challenges here.

22:14 Rising unemployment, there's a real estate crisis, real uneven growth,

22:19 which you is ea- easy to see on the streets.

22:22 So people here are eager to know that if there is stability,

22:26 then their own investments, their own money can go further and that's important

22:31 to many many ordinary workers and ordinary business owners.

22:35 Well, Laura, you and I are speaking Friday morning Paris time where I am,

22:41 uh early afternoon in Beijing where you are.

22:43 Donald Trump has just recently taken off from Beijing

22:47 and is on his way back to the United States.

22:49 There is some thinking that maybe some of the main communication

22:53 from the American side might come uh once he has actually left China.

22:57 And we know that Donald Trump is is something of a fan

23:00 of communicating specifically on board Air Force One, the plane.

23:05 But on balance, as we sit here now, Laura,

23:07 what's your report card for both of these two leaders in terms

23:11 of who achieved their aims and how well did they do?

23:17 It depends what those aims were.

23:19 I think for China the aim was Taiwan.

23:22 The aim was to ensure that the United States went

23:24 away and realized that the big issue for them is Taiwan.

23:27 The big red line is Taiwan and I think President Xi has done that.

23:30 I think for Donald Trump he wanted perhaps

23:34 Beijing's help with to end the war in Iran.

23:37 That is a tick.

23:38 But in terms of getting a signature trade deal,

23:40 remember Donald Trump has been trying to get a trade

23:43 deal with China since he first became president back in 2016.

23:47 In terms of getting a lasting trade deal,

23:50 that is still apparently quite far off.

23:53 He also needs China to buy more American goods,

23:57 things like American soybeans, American beef.

23:59 Now there are hints that that may have happened

24:01 and we hope to hear more in the coming hours.

24:05 But again, unless he gets that signature deal,

24:07 that is something that he wants as a win at home

24:10 that he can sell domestically to help his falling approval ratings.

24:15 So in terms of that, until we see that as a win,

24:18 then I would say that Donald Trump I still has work to do.

24:21 But of course there are other opportunities this year.

24:24 In fact, the leaders may meet a total of four

24:26 times and there is that reciprocal invitation them in September.

24:31 So there may be more to come on this.

24:32 Donald Trump may see this as unfinished business and may

24:35 hope to get it done before the end of his term.

24:38 Well, they may be meeting four times, Laura,

24:40 but as you revealed to me just before we started this recording,

24:45 Xi Jinping has another very important visitor arriving in Beijing soon,

24:49 we believe, which I was very surprised by.

24:52 Can you bring in our listeners on that bit of info, please?

24:55 Who's coming?

24:56 Well, Vladimir Putin is apparently coming to China

25:02 on one of his many visits to Beijing.

25:05 Vladimir Putin travels here a lot and he was expected

25:08 to arrive at kind of end of May, beginning of June.

25:11 But the timing is a little bit awkward.

25:14 I mean, obviously this visit by Donald Trump,

25:17 he was supposed to come in March and it's

25:20 been delayed because of the war in Iran.

25:22 So, the timing is not deliberate.

25:24 But, you know, you're saying goodbye to the American

25:26 president and then you're welcoming the Russian one.

25:29 When it comes to kind of rolling out the red carpet,

25:32 President Xi is becoming an expert.

25:34 Thank you so much, Laura.

25:35 Great to have you.

25:36 Lovely to talk to you again.

25:37 Hope to speak to you soon.

25:39 That was the BBC's senior China correspondent,

25:41 Laura Bicker, speaking to us from Beijing.

25:44 And that's it for this episode of The Global Story.

25:47 We're also an audio podcast.

25:49 You can find us every weekday,

25:51 Monday to Friday on bbc.com or wherever you listen.

25:55 Thanks for tuning in.

25:56 We'll see you next time.

25:57 Cheerio.

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