Wemby Ejected In Huge Wolves Win, HISTORIC Run For Knicks + Draft Lottery Winners & Losers

0:03 Hello and welcome to the Hoop Collective podcast.

0:06 We talk about the NBA, which we're doing on Sunday evening.

0:09 Joining us from Philadelphia,

0:11 Pennsylvania for the last time this season

0:13 at the Xfinity Mobile Arena is Tim Bonmps.

0:16 Hello everybody.

0:17 I leaned into the bit when I talked up the Sixers on the pod.

0:21 I backed up my words with my prediction.

0:23 Didn't go so great.

0:25 Wasn't a very good pick.

0:27 Heard a lot about it this week.

0:29 What are you going to do?

0:30 Yeah.

0:31 Nothing that we can say will be worse

0:32 than what Bontemps has heard from the Nick fans.

0:35 I just want, you know,

0:37 I've gotten all kinds of all kinds of all kinds of slander on the internet.

0:40 People yelling at me at the games.

0:42 It's all it's all in good fun.

0:43 Saw our guy Rick Brunson today.

0:45 He's like, I was looking for you.

0:46 I said, I'm sure you were.

0:48 Everybody's very happy in Knicks land, as they should be.

0:51 Yeah.

0:51 Just uh take it as an indication of your level of uh

0:56 people are paying attention.

0:57 Uh, and the Knicks are, as we will talk about, absolutely rolling.

1:01 Yes.

1:02 Um, that was absolutely, absolutely true.

1:04 Joining us from Los Angeles, California,

1:06 where he watched the Thunder go up 3-0 on the Lakers on Saturday

1:11 night and he will be at game four on Monday is Ban McMahon.

1:16 Howdy partners.

1:16 Listen, Bonds, could be worse.

1:18 You could have said that the Lakers were going to be the favorites in the West.

1:21 The results are pretty similar, but Oh, lordy.

1:25 Well, I am in Chicago where uh the NBA draft lottery

1:31 took place today here at the Navy Pier where I'm at now.

1:34 And I'll talk about that later.

1:35 I was in the room and I thought it'll be a fascinating experience.

1:39 But uh first I think we need to talk about the fascinating experience that was

1:44 the Wolves game four victory by five points

1:48 over the Spurs to even the series at 2-2.

1:51 And um while the end of this game was pretty

1:55 fascinating uh in terms of things that the Wolves did very

1:59 well to win it and also things that they didn't

2:02 do well to almost uh lose their lead, but it's 2-2.

2:06 Um but I think the only place that we

2:08 can start is what happened in the second quarter.

2:10 McMahon.

2:11 Um Victor Wmanyama.

2:13 Um you know, I haven't been on any

2:16 of the socials because I've been working on lottery coverage.

2:19 I don't I suppose there's got to be there's there going to be some

2:24 faction of the Spurs fan base

2:26 that thinks Victor Wanyama getting ejected was controversial.

2:29 I felt this was unfortunately a no-brainer uh decision.

2:35 He absolutely hauls off an elbows Nazare in the neck.

2:40 Uh chin first.

2:42 I guess that's true.

2:43 Um and is ejected.

2:45 And quite frankly, you know,

2:47 it it decides the game because the the um the Spurs have the lead in the fourth

2:52 quarter and they can't get a rebound or a stop in the paint when it matters.

2:55 And uh that Victor obviously would have been there

2:57 and so um just a complete loss of composure from Victor.

3:03 We we have applauded him on every front how he's mature beyond his years.

3:10 Um it was an unacceptable uh choice and it hurt his team and he

3:16 will help his team and carry his team to many wins in the future.

3:20 He hurt his team and he has extended their series in all

3:25 likelihood and so um that's just the way I saw it.

3:28 Yeah.

3:28 And you know Miss Johnson did make I would say an excuse for Wimby postgame.

3:34 Uh reading from Mike Wright's Twitter at some point he should be protected.

3:38 If not, he's going to have to protect himself.

3:40 Listen, were they being physical with him?

3:42 Yeah.

3:42 But this was like I'm watching it.

3:45 I'm saying, man, I hope he's not ejected.

3:47 And then you're watching the replay, you're like,

3:48 there's no way this could be ruled anything but a flagrant, too.

3:52 I mean, it was unnecessary.

3:54 It was excessive.

3:55 It was like there was no gray area here.

3:59 This was very black and white.

4:01 And unfortunately, that momentary loss composure

4:04 did cause him a kick kicked out.

4:06 The only thing I agree or disagree with you on rather is they lost the game.

4:11 Yeah, maybe it's different if Wimmy's in the game.

4:13 Sure, but they lost the game because

4:15 Anthony Edwards completely took over down the stretch

4:19 and the the Wolves for the second time in this series were dominant closers.

4:25 Um, so, you know, I'm going to give the Wolves some credit.

4:28 I don't mean to take the credit away from the Wolves,

4:30 but Rudy Goar is dunking down the stretch.

4:33 I'm not sure that's happening with Victor in there.

4:35 I mean, they're making nice plays, but you know,

4:38 you never know how the game would have gone if Victor was playing,

4:40 but the bottom line is he took himself out

4:43 of the game and Minnesota took advantage of it, and that that's what matters.

4:47 And I was very glad he got ejected.

4:49 I'm not looking for star players to get thrown out of games.

4:52 No, I just mean when he made the play,

4:54 I'm I'm glad they called it the way they should have

4:56 and didn't give him a flagrant one cuz he's Victor Wmanyama.

4:59 Like, it was a dirty play.

5:01 He deserved to get ejected.

5:02 If Nas Reed had done that to Victor, he would have got ejected.

5:05 So I maybe suspended.

5:08 Well, maybe I mean I don't think I mean somebody asked a a friend of mine

5:12 who's just a basketball fan said should

5:14 you know is Victor going to get suspended?

5:15 I do not believe Victor I mean they'll review it.

5:18 Like if you like if you see reporting

5:21 that it'll be reviewed all flagrants would be reviewed.

5:24 It's not

5:24 but he got he got a flagrant two.

5:26 He missed a game.

5:26 I think that's a more than reasonable penalty and there for game five.

5:31 Well, yeah.

5:32 I mean, I know.

5:33 I know.

5:34 Also, I thought Zack Zarber, the crew chief,

5:36 he like he very clearly articulated all

5:40 the steps of what is deemed a flagrant foul.

5:43 Like he he like dotted every eye and and crossed every tea to explain.

5:47 Um, and for as cerebral and as wellversed as Victor is,

5:51 do we honestly believe he didn't know?

5:53 No, no, no.

5:55 That was He knew the camera was on him like,

5:58 "No, he buddy, you know, flagrant two gets you tossed.

6:02 Come on.

6:02 You're in your third year in the league." So

6:03 what he's referring to is the camera saw him and he asks Harrison Barnes,

6:08 "What does it mean?" You know, they announced flagrant 2 and he's like,

6:11 "What does that mean?" And Harrison Barnes is like,

6:13 "It means you're ejected." And he goes,

6:14 "I'm ejected." And but he but he heard it and he didn't like fight it.

6:20 He just got up and left.

6:21 He got up and left.

6:22 And to your point, McMahon,

6:23 the Wolves took this one down the stretch because it looked for a minute like

6:27 the Spurs might pull this one out and really put a hammer blow on the series.

6:32 I mean, if Minnesota lost this game at home with Victor thrown out of the game,

6:36 it would have been very hard to see them winning three in a row.

6:39 But Anthony Edwards hits a bunch of shots.

6:42 He and Julius Randle made some big plays.

6:44 A sumu had a big bucket.

6:46 Um, like you said, Rudy got a couple of dunks late.

6:48 Brian, I mean, pretty much everybody that was on the court

6:51 at some point made some play to help them win the game.

6:55 Um, and you know, in a second round where

6:58 we might not have a lot of entertaining series,

7:01 we certainly got one with Spurs Wolves.

7:04 And game five in San Antonio is going to be super interesting on Tuesday

7:09 night when you got this Minnesota team that has already proven it is not afraid

7:13 of any opponent and has already got some big time upsets on its belt past

7:18 couple of years going up against a young Spurs team like we've talked about that

7:23 bunch of road playoff wins too.

7:24 Yeah, a bunch of road playoff wins against

7:26 a young Spurs team that like we've talked about hasn't really been in a lot

7:30 of these situations before and virtually other than Harrison Barnes,

7:34 I would say nobody else, I guess Luke Cornet, too.

7:36 Those are the two guys.

7:37 Everybody else on the team has either played

7:40 in the first round or not been the playoffs at all.

7:41 How dare you disrespect Kelly Alen.

7:44 That's true.

7:44 Forgot about Kelly on the end of the bench, too.

7:46 So, with eight minutes, well, call it nine minutes left,

7:50 the Spurs go to uh an eight-point lead.

7:54 The Wolves called timeout.

7:56 Um, here's how it went.

7:59 Uh, and Edwards 11 foot pullup and Edwards 27 foot pullup.

8:06 Uh, Jaden McDaniels hit a couple of free

8:08 throws and Edwards 25 point or 25 foot shot.

8:14 Uh, Nas Reed driving layup and then some good some dunks from Goar.

8:19 16 points in the fourth quarter for Ant.

8:22 Six of eight shooting.

8:23 hit a couple of threes as I just mentioned.

8:25 And and this is a guy who has two bad knees.

8:28 The runner's knee in one and a hyperextension in the other.

8:33 I I think I said this the other day, Ann's never been first team all NBA,

8:36 but you cannot name five guys you'd rather have in the playoffs than him.

8:40 I would take Ant over anybody in the Eastern Conference.

8:43 That's an interesting comment.

8:45 I'd take and I I love Jayen Brunson.

8:47 I'd take him over Brunson.

8:48 I I love Kate Cunningham.

8:50 For the playoffs, I'd take him over Kade.

8:52 got take him over.

8:53 You know, if you want to put Jason Tatum, Ant is an absolute killer.

8:57 He is obviously a mega talent.

9:00 He's got this competitive charisma that lifts up the rest of his team.

9:03 He impacts the game on both ends

9:05 of the floor and he is just absolutely fearless.

9:09 He is I mean he is a he's a he peaks in the playoffs.

9:14 He is just a he's built for this.

9:17 I'm not necessarily arguing with you.

9:18 I just when you said it, I was just thinking about it.

9:20 I mean, he's he's certainly right there with all those guys.

9:23 Don't think there's any at minimum, if not ahead of him.

9:26 I don't really feel like having this discussion right now.

9:28 I'm just going to keep going.

9:29 Trying to.

9:29 It's just an interesting No, it's fine.

9:30 No, I don't.

9:31 It's an interesting comment.

9:32 Credit for an interesting thought.

9:33 It is an interesting comment,

9:34 but I I uh I respectfully opt out of the discourse.

9:38 Yeah, we'll opt into 25 minutes of uh dissertation from the secret room later.

9:42 We got to save time for that.

9:43 Well, I mean, you know, it's Tell you what, Wendy,

9:46 Zara's hair is much better in place than yours is right now.

9:50 Yeah, my this is uh it's not it's not ideal.

9:52 I'm not going to lie.

9:53 It's been a long day.

9:54 Not compared to Bond Towns.

9:55 Bondtowns has been, you know,

9:57 they they they had the we'll talk about this later,

9:59 but I don't want to say that the that the Sixers didn't love their chances,

10:04 but they scheduled exit interviews before the game.

10:10 Um Well, that's that's not exactly fair.

10:12 Well, okay.

10:14 Like every time like every time we've covered an elimination game,

10:17 there was a plan if the season I know.

10:19 Okay, fine.

10:19 Sorry.

10:20 I take it all back serious.

10:21 They they they got enough things to clown on him for today.

10:23 They could have had they could use that after the first quarter.

10:27 They they certainly could have.

10:28 All right.

10:28 Anyway, Bon had a long day.

10:30 Um Nas Reed uh got rolled up on on his ankle in the fourth quarter there.

10:35 Um and I was like, "Oh man, that looks like a problem.

10:40 That looks like a high ankle spring is

10:42 what I was thinking." And I was like, "Damn,

10:45 like that's a potential real loss." And then

10:47 the guy comes back out and is making plays.

10:49 I'm telling you what, listen, the Spurs are the more talented team.

10:55 You know, I don't know what the odds are now,

10:56 but obviously they're they're the favorite team.

10:59 The Wolves, though, like you've got to love watching this team.

11:05 And they fight.

11:08 They've got high-end talent.

11:10 Um, you know, they can be they're an extremely frustrating regular season team,

11:16 but they are a flip the switch for the playoffs squad.

11:20 And Spurs got their hands full, man.

11:25 And Wimi, like, we haven't even talked about his game three performance,

11:30 which was just like jaw-dropping.

11:33 I mean, I'm watching on on a flight and I'm

11:35 just gasping at some of the things he did.

11:38 16 fourth quarter points on that game.

11:40 You know, at that point a 1-1 series.

11:42 He's on the road and just 395, five blocks, the Akeem spin fadeaway

11:48 that he hit over Go Bear in crunch time.

11:51 Like it was amazing.

11:53 But he followed that up by letting his team down today

11:56 and this series is tied up and and in the balance.

12:01 And you know, the Wolves definitely have the advantage of having

12:05 been there and having thrown knockout punches in the playoffs before.

12:08 Um, this reminds me a little bit of of Thunder Mavs from a couple years ago.

12:14 And that series, I believe, Tim was 2-2 after four, right?

12:19 And the Thunder missed some makeable shots

12:23 in games five and six and game, you know.

12:27 Yeah, their their youth showed up.

12:28 Their youth showed up in that series.

12:30 I mean, Luca was obviously great, but their youth showed up in that series.

12:33 They weren't Well, and and PJ Washington had the series of his life.

12:36 They actually did a great job on Kyrie

12:38 in that series and for most of it on Luca,

12:40 but you know, role players won that series.

12:42 Listen, role players won the Wolves last series.

12:45 Jay McDaniels is a role player who played out of his mind.

12:49 Uh they've got, you know,

12:50 Nas Reed's a role player capable of swinging a playoff series.

12:54 Iodumu is a role player capable of swinging a playoff series.

12:58 Yeah, Dumu came back.

13:00 You know, he's he's clearly not 100%.

13:02 He's he's limping through it,

13:03 but um he made a huge basket the in the fourth

13:06 quarter to help uh hold off the Spurs comeback.

13:09 I I really hate to just always focus or talk about the three-point shooting,

13:14 but I the modern NBA, it just comes down to it.

13:17 And in both Spurs losses in this series,

13:20 they have shot the ball poorly from three,

13:21 and they go six of 26 in this game.

13:24 They're not a great three-point shooting team.

13:26 And if they're hitting threes, they're going to be incredibly hard to beat.

13:31 And if they're not hitting threes,

13:32 which they definitely are capable of not hitting threes,

13:35 then they're going to potentially have some trouble scoring.

13:37 And you know, I mean, it's not it, you know,

13:40 it's not really like the uh it's not like they're

13:43 they all about the threes like say Boston is or something,

13:46 but you know, when you have Victor,

13:48 like if Victor's jumper is going like it was in game three, good luck.

13:52 Like you're you're probably not beating him, but Sure.

13:55 No, you're not.

13:56 If when Wimby sentence three, you're dead.

13:58 But to me, this was a case where

14:01 the Wolves closer delivered and the Spurs closer,

14:06 Darren Fox, did not down the stretch and he got off to a slow start.

14:09 Then he really got cooking in the second half.

14:11 Like Fox had a a stretch there where he was a big

14:14 reason why they had that lead and then down the stretch, you know,

14:17 and they weren't like a bunch of easy shots,

14:19 but down the stretch he just couldn't

14:21 knock down shots while Ant was going crazy.

14:24 And that, you know, Aaron Fox's role is to be the closer.

14:27 He missed six shots in the fourth.

14:28 I mean, he made a couple, but he missed six.

14:30 We missed three threes.

14:32 And um you know, like um yeah, I mean,

14:37 uh it's a it's a great it's a it's a really

14:39 good-look series and it's a real test for for the Spurs.

14:43 And you know, one thing I'll say is they have had a handful of challenges

14:47 in this series or in this postseason and um they've stepped up and delivered.

14:52 They found different guys to do different things.

14:54 Obviously, Victor is really important,

14:56 but um there's been games where Fox has played well,

14:58 games where Castle's played well,

15:00 games where Julian Champeni has been a differencemaker.

15:03 I I do think it was interesting Dylan Harper was great tonight,

15:06 right?

15:06 Um um down the stretch of this game,

15:11 um the Spurs played with the tallest guy on the court being Champenny.

15:15 They went super duper small and um the there

15:20 was like sort of a defining play where Nas Reed

15:22 got a put back off of of offensive rebound where

15:25 I think he was just bigger than everybody out there.

15:27 Um but the super small lineup gave the Wolves

15:31 some trouble at the end of the game.

15:32 They couldn't get the ball in bounds.

15:34 Um but um yeah, so it'll be a real challenge for the Spurs.

15:39 Look, look, we say this every year.

15:42 22 two series game five, three, three series game seven.

15:46 But obvious obviously huge, but two two series game five.

15:48 Reputations are made on that.

15:51 Two two series game five.

15:52 So, and and the Jackals will be ready

15:55 that they'll have that thing rocking down in San

15:57 and listen, Ant Edwards has a bunch of big road playoff games on his resume.

16:03 So, um, look forward to that.

16:05 Unfortunately, you guys weren't on those series.

16:08 You're on that series.

16:09 Um, the series that you are on, uh, Bontemps,

16:12 I'm gonna have to yield to you because I saw almost none of this game.

16:18 I was doing the lottery.

16:19 I was doing followup stuff.

16:21 Secret room in it, breaking it down after.

16:24 It's not a secret room.

16:25 It's a very, very easily to find room.

16:27 I took a nap at halftime and and

16:30 could have taken one earlier than that midway through the first quarter.

16:33 confidently decided to nap at halftime and dozed

16:36 to a fair amount in the second half.

16:37 Here's all we got to say about game four of Knicks Sixers.

16:41 The Knicks made 12 of their first 13 three-point attempts in the game.

16:46 And that is not to say that this is like, oh,

16:48 they just hit some shots and they won the game,

16:50 but it they had 43 points in the first quarter.

16:53 The game was over by the end of the first quarter.

16:54 Like they just came out.

16:56 Paul George said it best after the game.

16:58 He said they they hit us with some haymakers and they kept throwing them.

17:02 And I was like, "Yeah, they kept throwing them and hitting shot after shot after

17:05 shot." Stats Williams had the stat that they're 18 threes.

17:09 They were 18 for 29 from three in the first half.

17:11 They're 18 threes in the first half with the most

17:13 tied for the most in any game in NBA history, playoff or regular season.

17:17 Like they came out, they hit every shot.

17:20 They've been on an unbelievable heater offensively.

17:22 They have three games in the playoffs of over 130.

17:25 They've got two of over 140.

17:27 They have the two closeout games are both over 140.

17:31 Uh what did you what was the stats William stat on that?

17:33 I think it's the I want to say it was the first time the first team to score

17:39 at least 140 points in multiple series clinching wins

17:42 in the playoffs which again not a huge shock.

17:45 Not not many teams are scoring 140 points in the playoffs but as I said earlier

17:50 obviously uh picked Philly to win the series

17:52 and could not have been more wrong on that.

17:55 You're you're only 89 points off.

17:57 Yes, I was only 89 points off.

17:59 And uh look, the the Knicks the stuff that they

18:02 is that what was that what the spread was?

18:04 89.

18:05 I mean, I I mean, they won the day by 30.

18:07 So, by the way, the their average point differential through 10 games.

18:10 Remember, their two losses were both onepoint games.

18:12 That's right.

18:13 Their average point differential is 19.4 points per game.

18:18 That's the largest going in the conference finals since it went to 16.

18:21 Yeah.

18:22 The 16 team format in 8384.

18:24 Yeah, I mean, look, they've had a couple close games.

18:26 You know, game two in this series could have gone either way.

18:28 Obviously, like you said, they had the two one-point losses in the first round,

18:32 but since they changed their offense around after game three,

18:36 they against Atlanta, they have been just absolutely molten hot.

18:41 Listen to this.

18:42 And go ahead.

18:44 185 points is what they've outscored opponents by in that stretch.

18:48 That is the uh third best points differential in any seven game span period

18:54 just regular season or playoffs.

18:57 And I believe this is telling me Yeah.

19:02 third third best span ever and the best ever in the playoffs.

19:06 Yeah.

19:06 I mean it they were they were just they've been absolutely unbelievable.

19:10 And you know like obviously it was like

19:13 all right they did the stuff against Atlanta.

19:15 Atlanta has no size.

19:16 Let's see how they do against Philly.

19:17 And you could say that Embiid wasn't right.

19:19 That's fine.

19:20 Doesn't matter.

19:21 Like, yeah, these guys came in and just absolutely blew the doors off them.

19:26 And they I mean,

19:29 this is the the Knicks team that we spent all year kind of waiting to see.

19:33 It was like, you know, they all Vinnie wrote a story going

19:37 Vinnie Goodwill wrote a story about Carl Towns.

19:39 I think it was ran during the first round.

19:40 And the theme of the story more or less kept coming

19:43 back to the numbers say the Knicks are really really good,

19:46 but when you watch them play, you're like, I just it just doesn't quite line up.

19:50 And the last seven games, they've been I mean,

19:55 Oklahoma City's maybe been better in the playoffs,

19:57 but I mean, the Knicks have been

19:59 the second most impressive team in the playoffs easily.

20:02 They are massive favorites to beat whoever comes

20:06 out of this other series, which you know,

20:08 the Pistons and Cavs have both not been very impressive

20:11 at all through their first 10 games in the playoffs.

20:14 The one thing I will remind you of is

20:16 that the Pistons really beat up the Knicks during the regular season.

20:19 That's fine.

20:20 The I saw the I saw the Brooklyn Nets beat the Miami Heat with LeBron

20:24 three or four times in the regular season when they played in the playoffs.

20:26 Didn't matter either.

20:27 Like I don't think that that version of the Knicks we saw

20:31 in the regular season is not the version of the Knicks that's playing right now.

20:35 And Detroit barely got by Orlando and they're struggling

20:40 with a Cavs team that has been not impressive either.

20:43 So maybe they won't win the series.

20:46 They should go into the series as heavy heavy favorites.

20:49 And all they you know they came down here and you know game two was close.

20:54 came down here.

20:55 No, no, Gian and Obi.

20:56 It's like, okay, this could be a little

20:58 bit of an interesting situation for the Knicks.

21:00 They control game three basically from the six-minute

21:03 mark of the first quarter till the end.

21:05 And then the first six minutes are

21:06 only because Paul George couldn't miss a shot.

21:09 And tonight, like I said,

21:10 they hit 12 of their first 13 shots are up 20 in the first quarter.

21:13 And it's just a a laugher for the final 36 minutes of the game.

21:18 I mean, Sixer starters are out of the game by the middle of the third quarter.

21:22 Say final 44, but sure.

21:23 Uh Jackson has this stat.

21:25 They're the the fourth team in NBA

21:26 history to have multiple 30point clinching wins.

21:31 The other three 2025 Thunder, I think they ended up okay.

21:38 2008 Celtics.

21:42 Okay.

21:42 Uh you know that was the big three, the beginning of the big three.

21:45 And the 87 Lakers.

21:49 How about company?

21:50 Prime shows.

21:52 And look, the the Knicks had some really low lows during the regular season.

21:57 Like I remember when the Mavericks went up there,

22:00 like it was a terrible Mavericks team that just blew them out.

22:03 And I forgot exactly what it was, but they were in a real rut then.

22:07 I don't remember the exact I think it was

22:09 like seven losses in nine games or something like that.

22:12 But you don't have to be the best team all season.

22:17 You have to be the best team at this point.

22:21 And you know they in that way they they kind of remind me of the 2011

22:26 Mavericks who that team won 57 games but like

22:29 there was some nobody really believed in them.

22:32 There was some real blah stretches during the season.

22:36 Um you know they hadn't had any playoff success for the few years before that.

22:41 You know the Knicks actually had just not enough to keep their coach employed.

22:45 Um but you know what the Knicks look like in February

22:48 is not relevant to what they look like right now in May.

22:50 And right now they are absolutely playing like their peak uh of basketball.

22:58 They're playing as

23:00 Yeah.

23:00 This is the best they've looked in this whole run by a mile.

23:03 Like I mean and obviously it's easy to say

23:05 that when they're they're putting up these kind of point totals,

23:08 but I mean for again for a team that has felt like less than

23:12 the sum of their parts for a couple of years and all the fits

23:17 and starts they've had like the way they're I mean they're just an absolute

23:21 machine and it's fun to watch and they're I I mean it's wildly impressive.

23:27 It's so fun to watch that 70% of the crowd in Philly were were big fans.

23:31 Yeah.

23:31 Yeah.

23:31 Well, here here's here's what I want to say about that.

23:34 The Sixers, I think, completely screwed up.

23:38 Like, look, it's one thing for Joel to sit on the podium last week and say,

23:42 "Hey, I don't want Nick fans to come to the game." Like,

23:44 fine, Joel could say that.

23:45 For the Sixers to get out here and put all

23:49 all do all this PR campaign stuff over the last week.

23:52 Oh, got to keep the Knicks fans out of here.

23:54 We're going to geo tag tickets.

23:55 We're going to do this.

23:56 We're going to do that.

23:57 I mean, it's absolute nonsense.

24:00 It's an hour and a half to get here from New York City.

24:03 There's all sorts of Nick fans that live in Jersey.

24:06 That's it's nowhere near as expensive to go

24:08 to a game anywhere else than to go to the Garden.

24:11 All these people get a chance to go to a Nick

24:13 playoff game that they're never going to get to go to.

24:15 They're going to pay through the nose for it

24:17 compared to what people other paces will play

24:19 because they're saving a ton of money compared

24:21 to going to the Garden to watch a game.

24:23 So, the idea that the Sixers were ever going

24:25 to keep Knicks fans out of the building was crazy.

24:28 And all they did was put a giant cleague light on the fact

24:31 there were going to be Knicks fans in the building to begin with.

24:34 And then when they lose on Friday,

24:36 you had it perfectly set up where it's Sunday afternoon.

24:39 The Sixers are down three in the series.

24:41 Of course, Nick fans are going to come here dross for the game.

24:44 And of course, they're going to have an absolute party when their team is

24:46 12 for 13 from three and completely flying along and winning the game by 30.

24:51 Like, of course, this is how it's going to go.

24:53 And they had you as a piñata.

24:56 Listen, they would add me as a pinñata

24:58 if there were three fans in here, let alone

24:59 How many more times does Bonts have to make a Kulpa?

25:02 He's done it twice.

25:03 Does he does he I've had plenty I've had plenty of good calls.

25:06 This was not a good call.

25:07 So, I I can live with that.

25:09 Missed it by that much.

25:11 Hey, it's all it's all good.

25:14 Um, listen, I

25:15 make you make predictions.

25:15 Sometimes they work, sometimes they don't.

25:17 There are some people who want us to, you know,

25:20 beat you up, but I have been wrong once or twice.

25:24 Ah, I'm more than willing to beat him up for the people.

25:26 For the people.

25:28 Um, so postgame Joel Embiid had his exit interview.

25:31 Um, what did that entail?

25:35 Uh, he was weirdly positive.

25:37 I would say specifically about his health.

25:39 Um, like I didn't It's been a weird season for the Sixers.

25:44 Like even though it's been It's been a weird two weeks.

25:47 There are no Sixers season.

25:49 Well, that's true to to use Brian's line about NBA games,

25:52 but like two weeks ago today, right,

25:54 Joel Embiid came back in game four against the Celtics.

25:57 They got absolutely trucked.

25:58 He looked terrible even though he put up good numbers.

26:00 It looked like their season was over.

26:02 Then Joel has probably the best three-game stretch of his playoff career.

26:06 They beat the Celtics.

26:07 They have this great comeback.

26:09 It's like, wow, maybe the Sixers finally have everything come together.

26:13 He shows up for game one.

26:14 He doesn't look right.

26:15 Maxi hurts his finger in the second quarter of game one.

26:19 They end up going on or game I think it was game one or game two.

26:22 Either one he messes up his finger again.

26:24 They get absolutely trucked in the series.

26:25 They lose the final two games by a,000 points.

26:28 That's all in two weeks.

26:30 Like it's just it's and it and this is after

26:33 last season when they're coming into the year talk

26:37 and in the story I wrote before the season talking essentially

26:39 about hey we just got to get to the playoffs healthy.

26:42 We're going to be good.

26:43 And then they completely go off a cliff.

26:46 They tank to try to keep the top sixers pick to successfully keep it.

26:51 Successfully got a stud VJ Edgecom who had a m

26:54 like at 23 six and four on the road in game

26:57 seven at Boston Garden like a game like game seven

27:01 a lot of guys don't have in their whole career.

27:02 He had it as a rookie.

27:04 So it it's very hard to like sum up where the season was at.

27:07 But everybody with the but they would have been better off

27:10 with a hard fought game seven loss in Boston.

27:14 I I'm not going to say yes.

27:15 That's not to get and blown out your own home with Nick's fans going bonkers.

27:23 No way.

27:24 No.

27:24 Come on, bro.

27:25 Take that back.

27:26 I'm not going to humiliation of a series for the Sixers.

27:30 Yes, the Sixers got the Sixers got curb stomped by the by the Knicks.

27:33 But I'm not going to I'm not going to say that they

27:36 were better off not snapping their 44year losing streak to the Celtics.

27:41 Yeah, you don't have to say it.

27:42 I said it.

27:43 They got embarrassed.

27:44 Do you want to know why I'm in trouble now?

27:46 Because it's now my turn because Bonds ridiculously picked the Sixers.

27:50 You make that ridiculous comment.

27:51 It's I'm in the I'm up.

27:53 I'm up now.

27:54 God knows what it's in this spot.

27:57 I hope it doesn't happen on the pod.

27:58 Maybe he'll tomorrow on TV.

28:00 But any anyway, to get back to Embiid.

28:02 So Embiid said uh I I don't want to I don't want

28:05 to mess this quote up because I I think it's worth uh getting right.

28:10 So he he was very positive in his outlook about his knee.

28:17 Um I've been I'm as confident as I've ever

28:21 been about referring to his health and his future.

28:24 I think obviously my knee was the biggest concern and I'm not thinking

28:27 about it and as long as we keep doing what we've been doing,

28:30 I won't have to think about it anymore.

28:33 I'm looking at next year obviously being more available.

28:36 The personal goals don't matter,

28:37 I know that if I'm available and I play as much as possible,

28:40 everything else is going to follow.

28:43 And he also talked about how coming into the season,

28:45 he didn't know if his knee was going to really ever work again.

28:48 and he came out of the season feeling

28:50 like they've got it under control and he's going

28:53 to be able to go into the offseason and have a normal off season of working out.

28:57 Now, I am not going to sit here and say that, oh,

29:00 Joel Embiid is now going to play 75 games next season.

29:03 We're talking about a guy who missed a game in the series,

29:06 was playing with hip and ankle injuries in the series,

29:08 had an appendecttomy a couple of weeks ago,

29:10 and has not had a healthy playoffs in his entire career

29:13 and has never played 70 games in his entire career.

29:15 That's right.

29:15 He's played over the 65 game threshold twice.

29:18 Other than that, it feels great.

29:19 So, the last three years have been 39, 19, and 38.

29:23 Let's like I hope Embiid's right.

29:25 The like, but come on, man.

29:28 No, no, listen.

29:29 I agree.

29:29 I'm just repeating what the guy said.

29:31 I I was surprised at the My point was I was surprised

29:34 at the level of positivity that came from him about his health.

29:39 I didn't think it was going to be that I feel this good about things.

29:42 Put it like this.

29:43 The guy's going to be earning more than a million

29:45 dollars per game play because he's due 58.1 next year,

29:50 basically 62.7 the year after that, 67.4 the year after that.

29:56 Well, well, and look, I wrote I wrote an obit on the Sixers.

29:58 It's up now.

30:00 And basically like they've got this back

30:04 court with Tyrese Maxi who's going to be

30:06 all NBA player for the first time and probably will be again going forward.

30:09 He's awesome.

30:10 We talked about VJ Edcom.

30:11 He had a phenomenal rookie year.

30:13 He showed in these playoffs.

30:14 He's absolutely not afraid.

30:15 He's got a chance to be a full-blown star.

30:18 I think that's a a great place to start,

30:21 but they have a hundred plus million dollars

30:24 in Paul George and Joel Embiid the next two years,

30:27 and those guys have not been on the court.

30:30 And because you have all that money tied up in those two guys,

30:34 you can't do anything else with the roster.

30:36 So, you you can't really trade them.

30:38 And it's, you know, if they're available, great.

30:41 But again, Joel could say he feels great.

30:44 I hope he feels great for his sake,

30:46 but you have to assume he's going to miss at least 30 games.

30:50 If if he plays 50 games and is healthy for the playoffs,

30:53 and you're like, that's awesome.

30:54 They'll be happy with that, right?

30:56 If he could play 52 games and then be healthy for the playoffs,

30:58 they would they would take that today.

31:00 So, it it just puts them in kind of a strange

31:03 spot where you've got this stud rookie on a rookie deal,

31:07 which is exactly what you want to try to build a contending team.

31:10 And because you've got these other two guys on maxes, it sort of cancels out.

31:15 Well, and they have they have no depth.

31:17 Like Quinton Grimes was a was a good bench player, but like

31:20 who is an unrestricted free agent, right?

31:22 Kelly Ubé had a great bounce back couple of years with these guys,

31:25 has turned himself into a quality three and D

31:27 role player on the wing after being a, you know,

31:30 kind of an all offense, no defense guy in his career.

31:32 He's an unrestricted free agent.

31:34 Like, are they going to pay to keep those guys?

31:36 They better.

31:37 And the Thunder have their first round pick.

31:39 Do do they have anybody's pick?

31:41 Are they Do they have a Do they have I'm serious.

31:43 Like, do they have a No, I'm saying have a firstrounder.

31:47 I thought you were making a joke.

31:48 The Sixers have Houston's first round pick,

31:51 which they got from Oklahoma City as a result of the Jared McCain trade.

31:58 Wait, Jared McCain?

31:58 Is that the guy who had 18 points in 18 minutes in a playoff win

32:02 right before the Sixers had fewer than that in a whole game off their bench?

32:06 Considering the Knicks uh the Sixers have been missing open

32:09 threes all series and considering Jared McCain as we head

32:13 into game four is uh I am not kidding 9

32:16 for 11 from three-point range in three games against the Lakers.

32:21 Might have been helpful to have Jared McCain hitting some threes.

32:25 Well, at least Daryl got to take a victory lap

32:27 by telling the world that he sold high on that one.

32:31 Yeah.

32:31 So again, it's like the six it you can't win them all, guys.

32:36 You can't win them all as I as I'm evidence of.

32:39 When you lose, you probably shouldn't do a victory dance.

32:42 Well, and that's and that's why that's why everything with this team

32:44 is just at such a weird place because like on the one hand,

32:48 the young guards are awesome.

32:49 It's a great place to build from.

32:51 On the other hand, they're basically hamstrung

32:54 to do really anything else around them going forward.

32:57 And they really are realistically at least for another

33:01 season until Paul George is an expiring deal.

33:05 Probably even two years until Joel Embiid's an expiring deal after that.

33:08 Paul George comes off the books.

33:10 So they got to just kind of hope those guys

33:12 can play and these young guys keep getting better.

33:14 And I think DJ's going to get better and I think Tyrese will get better,

33:17 but it they're they're not very deep and they

33:20 don't have a lot of ways to add talent.

33:22 And that's especially if they keep Ubé and Grimes, they lose either of them.

33:26 I mean, then they're really hurting for depth and there's

33:29 just not a lot of ways to add back from there.

33:32 All right.

33:33 Well, Bon Temps will see in the Eastern Conference Finals, I guess,

33:38 which by the way will will the earliest they can start is Sunday.

33:43 So, we'll see about Cavs Corner and uh Pistons.

33:47 I suspect Cavs Corner will be lingering on through the week,

33:50 but we'll find out on that.

33:53 Lingering.

33:53 That's what you say about uh the James Harden powered calves.

33:57 That's the chatter that you have.

34:00 Um all right.

34:01 Well, we'll see if we get to the Cavs

34:02 here before I wave the white flag on this podcast.

34:04 But, um uh so I did the lottery today.

34:08 Flew into Chicago this morning.

34:09 Uh it was a beautiful day for a lottery, boys.

34:12 Beautiful day for a lottery.

34:13 You know, it's one of my favorite days of the year.

34:15 And um I'd never done the room before.

34:18 and and the room will never be the same after,

34:20 you know, they let the media in basically for transparency.

34:23 Okay.

34:23 They let, you know, a handful of media members in um

34:28 uh it was a very strong podcast media core in there.

34:33 Zach Low, Ryan Rasillo, myself.

34:37 I feel like um we could have all united, you know,

34:42 if if certain things didn't keep us apart,

34:45 we could have all united in one big glorious podcast.

34:48 We could have done it live.

34:51 Um you see that he's trying to push us out of the live show business, Bont.

34:55 Clearly, just off the pod, period.

34:58 Exactly.

34:58 Bigger names.

34:59 Exactly.

34:59 I would love to trade for those two guys.

35:02 Um anyway, so um

35:05 he thinks they can sell high on us like Mory s there's no clearly trust me.

35:11 We'll be in the we'll be in the playoffs when they've gotten sent home.

35:13 I promise you that.

35:18 Well done.

35:18 You just redeemed yourself for that earlier take um about the Sixers.

35:23 Okay.

35:23 So uh go in the room um and do we

35:27 need to go over like the concept of the drawing room?

35:29 Do do we give our viewers and listeners credit for knowing

35:32 that the actual lottery is drawn an hour before the show?

35:35 Yes.

35:35 Yes.

35:36 U also I think one thing that um that I would

35:38 point out is that when you see the lottery on television,

35:41 you know, it obviously goes from 14 backwards

35:43 to one and four is revealed before one.

35:46 But when they actually do the drawing, one is drawn first.

35:49 1 2 3 and four are drawn and then

35:52 the rest of the previously established order is there.

35:55 I just thought I would point that out.

35:56 So, there's one representative from each team in there and um

36:00 everyone's got their gets their um um phones taken away from them,

36:06 sealed, what have you.

36:08 So, um there's these boards when you walk

36:10 in all the um the lottery combin board, eight boards.

36:16 And then there's this woman, she's one of the league lawyers,

36:19 her name is Caitlyn Canela West.

36:21 And while there's people up there like lawyers and Ernston

36:26 Young people and whatnot are up there looking at the lottery,

36:30 this woman Caitlyn uh Caitlyn,

36:32 she is up there who makes she figures out who wins each pick and makes

36:36 the calls and she is an expert at this and she is like the bellweather guide.

36:41 And so the boards, the eight of them,

36:44 the farther left are the teams with the highest chances.

36:49 Um the lower numbers have the higher chances.

36:51 And so like if if you have pick one,

36:54 two, three, four, whatever the ball one, two, three, four,

36:56 whatever, you have a more chance of one

36:58 of the higher chance teams and they're on the left side.

37:01 And then if you pull ball 13, 14,

37:03 those combinations tend to favor the longer shots and they're on the right side.

37:08 And so Sam Prey, the Mavs were right side.

37:10 Correct.

37:11 Last year,

37:12 right?

37:12 And so Sam Prey, who he was at your game um Saturday night in uh in LA,

37:17 saw the Thunder go up 3-0, blowout win,

37:20 and gets in a plane, flies overnight, and gets there,

37:22 and he's in the room because the Clippers,

37:24 they have the Clippers pick, which is a 12th pick.

37:26 Well, he he can make that kind of transition

37:28 now because he's using less product in his hair,

37:30 so it doesn't take him as long to get, you know, right.

37:33 Yes, he has gone with a different hair look.

37:35 Um Yeah.

37:36 So, we didn't talk about that.

37:38 So he said basically, he goes,

37:39 "I need Kate," he goes," Caitlyn's a genius at this, and she's

37:42 the she's the one to watch." And he goes,

37:44 "I need her to go to the right." Yeah.

37:47 He goes, "I need Caitlyn to be so far right

37:50 that she's almost out the door." And if that happened,

37:52 and here's the thing, he didn't he doesn't need anything.

37:54 He would prefer.

37:56 Okay.

37:56 I don't remember the verb he used, but he might have said might have said want.

38:00 Um, there.

38:00 So, uh, the first seven seats are the higher chance

38:06 teams and then then there's a second row of seats.

38:08 And so, the first seat in the first

38:11 row is for the biggest loser, the worst record.

38:14 Now, the the the the top three uh Nets, Pacers,

38:18 and Wizards all have the same odds,

38:20 but the Nets the Wizards had the worst record.

38:22 So, Michael Winger, team president, is sitting in the first seat.

38:25 Okay, here comes the lottery.

38:27 Um, balls 421 come out and everyone's watching Caitlyn and she's moving left.

38:33 Bro, those are low numbers.

38:35 She's on the far left side and as soon as

38:38 she's she's moving into tank territory,

38:40 right?

38:41 As soon as 421 come out, as soon as the one comes out, Ted Woo,

38:44 who's the assistant GM of the Pacers,

38:47 he looks I'm sitting like 10 feet from Winger.

38:50 She he looks at Winger and taps him on the hand.

38:54 And what I found out later was that the after

38:56 three balls the war the Wizards clinched it.

38:59 They had every combination that was one.

39:02 Wow.

39:02 Dude, the Anthony Davis uh deadline

39:05 acquisition is critical to winning the lottery.

39:08 We know that now.

39:09 Sure is.

39:10 We'll see if the Wizards can parlay that value at the deadline next year.

39:15 So, uh I don't even remember what the last one number was.

39:18 It didn't matter.

39:18 It was known the Wizards won.

39:19 So, the Wizards won by a thousand.

39:21 they they they they one going away was a route and uh

39:25 Winger who I've known for 20 years um known I know him

39:28 when he worked at four different organizations um he doesn't he just

39:33 sort of rubs his chin he doesn't do anything no reaction but I

39:37 know and this is one of the things is that you're

39:38 in this room and I know Bontemps you've been in this room each one

39:42 of these guys represents like hundreds of thousands millions of fans and you

39:48 know and their whole organization and you know in this particular case,

39:51 so many of these teams tanked, you know.

39:53 Well, and it's one thing if it's like some random minority owner or, you know,

39:59 some low lowlevel staffer or something.

40:01 In this case, it's the guy who like instituted the plan to do this.

40:07 You know, it's a little different.

40:08 And has had bad lottery luck until now.

40:12 Yes.

40:12 Well, sorry wasn't bad lottery luck, but Right.

40:16 Well, certainly bad lottery.

40:17 Yeah.

40:18 They had bad luck last year.

40:19 Yeah.

40:19 So he I know inside I mean you know he

40:23 decorum reigns whatever but I know inside that his whole

40:28 I believe they went one and 27 to end the season.

40:31 They didn't do that to get the fifth pick.

40:33 Yeah they really worked for this one.

40:34 You can imagine just what he must have been

40:37 feeling inside in the moment but he betrays nothing.

40:40 So, um, now we come to the second, um, pick and the first ball out is 14.

40:52 Caitlyn is headed right, boys.

40:54 Uh, oh.

40:55 And, um, the Clippers, why I say the Clippers, it's really the Thunder.

41:01 The Thunder have 15 combinations.

41:03 Okay.

41:04 Eight of them have the number 14 in them.

41:07 Oh, boy.

41:08 So I am like oh and here's the thing

41:11 there is some there is some puckered the guy

41:14 other regions in that room at that point

41:16 Matt this league lawyer Matt Dorya who draws the balls he lets like 30 I

41:20 don't know maybe it feels like 30 seconds pass I don't think it's 30 seconds

41:25 whatever it's some period of time where you can look and you can look

41:29 and see all the 14s on the Thunder and you're like oh my god like

41:34 and I'm thinking like can you imagine if the Thunder

41:36 get the number two pick Can you imagine that?

41:39 And um so you know, I don't know what Sam was thinking.

41:44 He his face doesn't change,

41:45 but so 14 comes out and she's all the way down there to the right.

41:49 Um but then the next three numbers, I don't even remember what they were.

41:52 They were they were low and um the word

41:57 comes out that has never been said in a lottery.

42:01 uh in 40 years of the lottery.

42:04 Uh never once have the Utah Jazz ever moved up.

42:07 In fact, they've only move they've moved

42:08 down like five times including last year

42:10 they lost like three spots and for the first time ever she announces Utah.

42:15 All that tank had finally paid off.

42:17 Tank note baby.

42:18 And Austin H was sitting there with like his you know he was like

42:22 leaned forward like almost like you know and he goes yeah and he goes yeah.

42:26 It was the only emotion in the room but he couldn't help himself.

42:29 He's like yeah.

42:29 And I'm like, go for it.

42:30 Like, celebrate like what you guys went through.

42:32 And Preston is probably just staring daggers at him.

42:34 After all the grief the Jazz got this year across the board when

42:38 there were all sorts of other people doing the same things they were doing,

42:41 including the team that picked third

42:42 and got absolutely no grief for it, Memphis.

42:44 We'll get to in a second.

42:45 Good for Good for Austin and good for the Jazz.

42:48 Yeah.

42:48 So, um you know, he celebrates and um um uh now you're two picks in.

42:55 Um, so, uh, and he just he immediately you could his body language changed.

43:00 Like he was like leaning off all forward.

43:01 He literally just leaned back.

43:03 You know, it's funny.

43:04 Remember it was a couple weeks ago there was a tie break

43:06 that they got to get the fourth uh slot instead of the fifth slot.

43:10 And that Yeah.

43:11 And you say, well, what's the difference between the fourth

43:13 and fifth slot when the the ping pong balls are the same?

43:16 Well, in the event that like craziness had happened

43:19 and four teams from the back half had jumped up.

43:22 If the the Jazz had finished fifth in the lottery positioning,

43:25 they could have lost their top eight protected

43:27 pick in the end to Oklahoma City anyway.

43:29 So even though there was a 1% chance at the time,

43:32 they were kind of sweating the coin flip for that too a couple weeks ago.

43:36 So, you know, that's it's been an interesting couple of weeks for the Jazz.

43:40 Okay, so they draw the the fourth one uh the third

43:44 the third pick and the first ball out is a four.

43:49 And sitting down at the end of the first row is Zack Kimman,

43:53 the Memphis Grizzlies.

43:54 And as soon as he hears four, inside his head, he's like,

43:58 "Bleep." Because all the combinations the Grizzlies had, there was no four.

44:04 If you ever heard four, no dice.

44:08 I'm sorry, it wasn't four.

44:09 Two.

44:09 Whenever two was uh was heard, no Grizzlies.

44:13 If anything with a two in the Grizzlies couldn't win.

44:15 So Zach was like, "Damn, we didn't get the third." You know,

44:18 we didn't get one, we didn't get two.

44:19 No, he didn't get three.

44:20 They pulled the numbers and um it's Utah again.

44:25 Yes.

44:25 The Jazz get two and three.

44:27 So after 40 years in every, you know,

44:30 they were in the lottery 11 because remember

44:31 like the first like 20 years of the lottery.

44:33 They made the playoffs every year with Stockton and Malone.

44:35 So they haven't been in that many lotteryies,

44:36 but they still they were 0 of 11 in moving up in lotteryies.

44:40 Now they get up they get moved up two in a row.

44:42 So, they redraw um and the first number up and the redraw is 13.

44:50 Oh boy, we're headed right, boys.

44:54 There goes Caitlyn down to the right side.

44:56 Now, uh this guy from the front office of the Charlotte Hornets,

44:59 I'd never met him before.

45:00 His name is Jake Stone.

45:02 Young guy, I think he went to an Ivy League school.

45:06 Um he was told by the owner of the of the Hornets

45:10 um Rick Schnull he's Rick like the last thing he

45:13 goes 13 Jake anytime you hear 13 all of our combinations

45:17 have 13 in it you hear 13 it's money for the Hornets.

45:21 Well the Hornets you know had five10 of a you know half of 1% chance.

45:26 So Jake hears 13.

45:28 He's like, "Whoa." You know, whoa.

45:30 He's He's on the edge of his seat.

45:31 But you know, as he said to me, he goes, "We only had five combinations." Like,

45:36 "We needed we needed a lot of help beyond just a lot of luck for that."

45:40 So the next number was four.

45:43 Well, it's the Grizzlies who have all the fours.

45:48 Oh.

45:47 So that's when it changed.

45:48 And um so how are they going to how are they going to find playing time with all

45:54 those you know all those guys that they had down the stretch of the season?

45:57 Anyway, the Grizzlies get the number three pick.

45:59 If Zack Edy can stay healthy,

46:01 which is a huge if um either Camboozer or Caleb Wilson,

46:06 who will probably be the two guys sitting there for them to choose from a three,

46:09 will be awfully fun playing next to Zach Giddy.

46:12 That is a very interesting spot.

46:13 You know what what's interesting is uh you we're assuming Peterson's

46:19 going to be a top two pick and then the other guards

46:22 at least listen we don't know we just know what people

46:24 who know what they're talking about say the other guards aren't supposed

46:27 to be three or four I I can just say

46:30 the lottery results will have no impact on the approach moving forward

46:34 with John Marant like they're going to try to find a home

46:36 for John Mar regardless of where they ended up in the lottery.

46:41 Okay.

46:41 Well, but they've got Yeah.

46:44 And they've got to stay healthy.

46:46 Cedric Coward's a guy like they they've got

46:48 a chance to start building something back up.

46:50 I I had way too much respect in Decor to bring this up to Austin,

46:53 but Austin, but I was like,

46:55 I wonder after after they they got the pick two and three,

46:59 I wonder how much they were thinking about that $500,000 fine.

47:02 Do you think that uh do you think that was still on their minds?

47:05 U cost of doing business for Ryan Smith.

47:07 He was all right with it.

47:08 I mean, he pays more than that for BYU's 12th man.

47:11 If he'd have known he was getting the second pick and he could have paid for it,

47:14 he'd have paid 100 times that and maybe Exactly.

47:18 So, um, and you know, Memphis tanked pretty hard down the stretch.

47:20 So, they, um, Memphis, listen, the top three hardest tankers.

47:25 Memphis was the most egregious tanker,

47:27 but you know what I was thinking about as uh, and Zach was pretty passive.

47:30 You know, he explained to me later what he was thinking,

47:32 but um, um, I was thinking in my head Memphis Grizzy's medical update.

47:37 Now, I know some of them were a little

47:39 little shaky down the stretch of the season,

47:41 but there was a lot of Memphis Grizzlies

47:43 medical updates over the last couple years that were,

47:45 you know, putting karma in the bank.

47:47 You know, they had so, you know,

47:48 and but then down the stretch of the season, let's just be clear,

47:51 they managed to put together a team

47:52 that would not have made the G-League playoffs.

47:55 Correct.

47:55 I saw Zack Climbing in Kansas City at the Big 12 tournament and I said,

48:00 "You're going to get the six." He said, "I don't know.

48:03 I don't know." He said, "Zack, let's see what you guys are doing every day.

48:06 you're going to get to six.

48:08 And they got to six and that got him to three.

48:11 So they they got to their spot

48:13 and they have had some lottery luck over the years.

48:16 Got Jaw from nine.

48:17 I believe that was that was part of a coin

48:19 flip that landed a certain way positioning wise.

48:22 And they jump up.

48:23 Got Jiren at four.

48:25 I think that's Oh, that actually was under maybe the old system.

48:28 I don't remember exactly, but um yeah.

48:30 Yeah.

48:31 No, they've had some they've had some picks and and like I said,

48:34 either one of those bigs, assuming, you know, knock on wood, Zach Edy,

48:37 who was very impressive in the little bit he was able to play.

48:40 That's a pretty interesting front line going forward

48:42 if if they can stay on the court.

48:43 Okay, so the fourth pick, this is where um

48:49 this is where things got, you know, pretty nasty.

48:53 Not nasty, the Clippers Pacers paradox is in full effect at this point.

48:57 Yes, that is exactly what happened.

48:59 So Ted Woo again, Clipp Pacers front office,

49:03 he is sitting in sort of seat two and sitting off by uh

49:07 the media um because the Clippers did not have a side on the deas,

49:12 but the Clippers had skin in the game.

49:15 Um and um uh I am going to botch um this gentleman's name.

49:22 I just met him today for the first time.

49:25 Um he's uh he's a uh um front front office member.

49:31 Hold on one second.

49:36 Uh okay.

49:37 Uh I just met this gentleman today and I'm

49:39 going to I'm going to mess up his name.

49:40 I want to apologize that I cannot pronounce his name correctly.

49:44 Um I think it's pronounced something along the lines of Rishub Desai.

49:50 I know him and I don't know how to pronounce his name.

49:54 Nice guy.

49:55 Great.

49:56 Great guy.

49:56 So he is So Ted Woo is sitting there and he looks over at Reishub

50:03 and they have like a little one second moment where they just sort of go,

50:06 you know, like, "Oh boy, here we go." You know,

50:10 because basically if the if the if

50:14 the Pacers came up fourth, they keep the pick.

50:17 If they don't come up fourth,

50:19 the Clippers get the fifth pick is what it comes down to.

50:22 So, um, out come the numbers and the first number up, um, I believe is a seven.

50:30 And that was really not good

50:32 for the Pacers because the Pacers had 140 combinations, um, of the thousand.

50:37 So, they have 14% um,

50:39 but only seven of their 140 combinations had the number seven in it.

50:45 So, right out of the gate, the first seven that comes up,

50:48 um, they are down to seven, you know, whatever 7/10en of a percent.

50:55 Like, it it's it's really bad.

50:56 The Clippers percentages explode there.

51:00 Um, the next two numbers um are six and, um, I think nine.

51:08 Um, and when that those two happened, the Pacers were down to one combination.

51:15 So, here we last ball of the lottery.

51:17 The Pacers needed a one.

51:20 So, a 7, six, and nine had come out.

51:22 There's 14 balls.

51:23 A 7, six, and nine had come out, but they were still alive.

51:27 There were 10 balls left.

51:28 They needed, they needed the one to come.

51:31 And if so, it's a 10% at that point.

51:33 The one comes out, they get the fourth pick.

51:37 Anything else comes out, Clippers get the fifth pick.

51:40 And I was watching Joe Sai from the Nets

51:43 sitting one seat over and once the third ball came, the Nets were eliminated.

51:49 And he just looked like he he was ashen.

51:53 Um because you know what the Nets I mean, you know, and I felt con you know,

51:57 as much as I was happy for some people, I felt compassion in the room, you know.

52:01 Um, you know, I don't know how much compassion you're going

52:02 to feel for one of the richest men on the planet,

52:04 but you know, I I know what they've

52:06 they made this trade with the Rockets and I I think

52:09 it was the right thing to do in the situation they were

52:11 in, and they set themselves up to to be awful in the two

52:15 years that were loaded drafts and they dropped four spots last year,

52:20 had the worst possible luck they could have,

52:22 and they dropped three spots this year.

52:25 And it, you know, it's just there's just

52:29 not much else you could say than that really.

52:31 They just, they had terrible luck both years.

52:33 And then and then next year,

52:35 the Rockets still have swap rights because they made a trade where they

52:41 didn't even get all of their stuff back and they gave up four picks.

52:45 Yeah.

52:45 And I think it really wouldn't even have made um wouldn't even have

52:50 made uh that much of a difference if they had not made that trade.

52:53 I think it I guess they d I guess they only dropped back a couple spot.

52:56 I guess it was two or three spots last year, not four.

52:58 But yeah, like they they were in the top five or six

53:01 in the odds two years in a row and struck out both times.

53:05 That, you know, that's why the lottery is a lottery and why it's far

53:11 from a certainty that you're going to be up there if you're in the top four.

53:15 And obviously that's the situation the Pacers found themselves in today also.

53:19 Yeah.

53:20 Um so and then uh the Pace one of the Kings minority owners was there.

53:24 He's been one been u one of their minority

53:26 owners since even before VC bought the team.

53:28 John Kiotus I think his name I probably botched that but he

53:32 was there and he was a very nice guy very jovial.

53:34 He was on one side Austin Angels on one side

53:37 and Zack uh Kheim was on the other and he's congratulating

53:40 them all of them through the whole lottery and he's got

53:42 no luck and they slide all the way back to seven.

53:44 So the last ball comes up and it's not a one, it's a nine.

53:48 And uh on the second row um uh the Bulls uh they are

53:54 the the the team that came up from ninth to move into fourth.

53:57 Uh obviously a lot of excitement here in Chicago about it.

54:00 They need to jump start um uh to jump start their thing.

54:04 And so that's it.

54:05 And Bryson Graham gets a fourth pick and the 15th pick

54:08 to start his tenure as executive with lead executive with the Bulls.

54:11 See what he does with those.

54:12 Yep.

54:12 So I went down.

54:13 So, um I will say this, as soon as the lottery ended, um Sam Prey came over.

54:18 He was one of the he he kind of came over from far away

54:21 in the room and he got to Michael Winger and he shook Michael's hand.

54:25 And you know, Winger worked for him for seven years in Oklahoma City.

54:28 I mean, in many ways, what Winger is trying to build in um you know,

54:34 in Washington is modeled after the Thunder.

54:37 I mean, he hired Will Dawkins from the Thunder to be his GM.

54:40 And um Brian Keefe, an old Thunder uh assistant coach as well.

54:45 He's bounced around the league, but that's true.

54:47 And um so Winger says to Sam, "Uh, hey,

54:51 thank you so much for the note." And so I

54:55 asked about that and apparently uh Sam sent Winger a note,

54:59 you know, wishing him luck.

55:00 So maybe sent it to everybody in the room, covered all his bases.

55:04 Did he send it to Austin H?

55:05 I I don't can't speak on that.

55:08 Don't know.

55:08 Um uh the reason he's saying that is because the uh the J the Jazz pick was

55:13 top eight protected and they were not making they

55:15 were making sure it wasn't going to the Thunder.

55:17 The Jazz pick has been protected for three years.

55:19 I think it was 1088 or maybe 108, whatever.

55:22 And uh it turns out that the the Thunder

55:26 just took Derek Favor's salary on as a charity project.

55:29 They never got anything for it.

55:30 Well, anyway, um and so Winger said that he'd sent him a good luck uh note.

55:36 So, um, yeah.

55:37 So, I then went downstairs and, um, the Jazz were, as you could imagine,

55:42 I mean, obviously the Wizards, uh, Wizards were over the moon.

55:46 Um, uh, the Jazz, you know, Justin Xanic, their GM, Danny A.

55:52 Um, uh, you know, they were just, look, it's huge for them.

55:56 I mean, they're going to end up with one of these perimeter players

55:59 to go with Keonte George who was up on the Deis and uh,

56:03 you know, with their their big trio of Larry

56:05 Markin and Walker Kesler and Jiren Jackson Jr.

56:09 and Ace Bailey last year.

56:11 Like, I mean, this is exactly what the Jazz were trying to do.

56:14 They were trying to be bad one more year,

56:16 get one more high bite at the Apple in a really deep

56:19 draft and like they they could easily be in the playoffs next year.

56:23 Like, they could be really good ne as soon as next year.

56:26 like they got a deep interesting team.

56:29 Will Will Hardy, friend of the pod,

56:31 has had to deal with a lot of losing the last several years.

56:34 He can finally be unleashed to just coach for 82 games.

56:37 I'm sure he'll be excited about he's allowed to use his powers for good now.

56:41 Yes, he is.

56:42 So, um it's uh you know, but they've they've been

56:46 doing this for a while and it you know,

56:49 it's they're going to be a lot of fun to watch next year.

56:51 I talked to both AJ Deansa and Darren Peterson.

56:53 I had not met Darren.

56:54 I met him today.

56:55 I uh I've known AJ for a while and talked to him and you know Discovery McMahon.

56:59 He's got both the top two picks now.

57:03 Add him to the list when he's like some of these agents.

57:05 He's pretty good at at getting the top of the lottery.

57:08 He knows to how to identify the big stars like yourself.

57:12 Saw Messiah, the new president of the Mavericks.

57:14 Congrat Mike Schmidz.

57:16 And Mike Schmidz Mike Schmidz, our former colleague at ESPN just hired

57:20 as the general manager of the Dallas Mavericks.

57:23 I got to already got a deal McB now.

57:26 Yes, he's thrilled.

57:27 I know.

57:27 Um, so yeah, Mike's great.

57:30 Good for him.

57:30 You know, listen, but in all seriousness though, like with Messiah and Mike,

57:34 they've got some guys who like these are

57:37 dudes who specialize in knowing what talent looks like.

57:41 And obviously, they didn't have a lottery luck today.

57:43 They're going to have the ninth pick.

57:45 They've got the Thunder at the end of this uh,

57:47 you know, the Thunder's pick at the end of the first round.

57:50 And they've got a they don't have a firstrounder next year.

57:53 Then it's Thunder swap and then they I forgot.

57:57 Oh, they've got the Lakers in 29 and then it's a Spurs swap.

58:01 They got that Cooper guy though, so they'll be okay.

58:03 Yeah, they got him.

58:04 And they're going to have to nail some late first rounders

58:06 and they've got some guys who know what they're looking at.

58:08 So Kevin Pritchard, the president of the P the Pacers was here and he

58:12 immediately talked after the words and he's um you know look they made the trade

58:16 at the trade deadline to acquire uh Vitza Zubach and um uh the pick was top

58:23 four protected and he openly admits that he

58:27 feels terrible and um you know it's 50s.

58:30 Let's call spade a spade.

58:31 The Pacers made that trade cuz they're cheap.

58:33 Like Vita Zubat's a good player,

58:35 but they made that trade and gave up a premium to get him because he's

58:39 on a very good contract and so they could probably stay under the luxury tax,

58:43 which they haven't paid in 20 years.

58:45 And at the end of the day, he's a really good player,

58:49 but when the second they made that trade, we were all like, "Wow,

58:53 that is a high price to pay to potentially have all

58:56 this losing and strike out and miss uh on this draft." And yes,

59:01 I know they get their unprotected pick back in 2031.

59:05 That's fine.

59:06 This is a team that in theory is going to be in the mix next year.

59:09 And if they had gotten the double bite at it

59:12 and gotten Zubots and a top four pick in this year's

59:15 draft to go with Tyrese Albert and getting back and Pascal

59:19 Seakum and all the other guys they have that, you know,

59:21 that would have been a heck of a move,

59:23 but it was a heck of a highwire act to take with this draft pick.

59:28 And again, like they don't they didn't have a center

59:33 in the first place cuz they decided not to pay Miles Turner,

59:35 which I can understand.

59:37 Honestly, that that given the price that it was doesn't look bad.

59:40 I was going to say I can understand why they didn't pay Miles Turner.

59:42 That contract doesn't look great,

59:44 but they paid the price they did for Zubots both because he's a good

59:48 player and because he had a pretty

59:50 cheap deal relatively to relative to his talent.

59:53 Well, and and and here's part of Pritchard's post on uh on X.

59:59 I own Taking This Risk.

1:00:01 Surprised it came up fifth after this year.

1:00:03 I thought we were due some luck.

1:00:05 Like, you knew it was a coin flip.

1:00:07 Basically, it was literally a 50/50 coin flip.

1:00:10 I mean, it was slightly 48 52 48 whatever.

1:00:13 When he spoke to the media, he articulated it a little differently.

1:00:15 He said, "If we would have paid a bigger price if we

1:00:23 had to trade a pick that was top eight or 10 protected,

1:00:27 we wouldn't we we, you know, or we do not get a player as good as Zubots."

1:00:31 Well, of course.

1:00:32 Of course, because then the Clippers can do the math, too.

1:00:34 And so he said, "And we have our pick now in five of the Look,

1:00:37 I'm not defending him.

1:00:38 I'm just telling you what he said, just to be clear."

1:00:40 Well, it's not a matter of defending or not.

1:00:42 Like, it just the facts are what they are.

1:00:43 The Pacers are not a team The Pacers are not a team that pays a luxury tax.

1:00:47 They paid they haven't played the luxury tax in 20 years.

1:00:49 They took a risk and it it hurt and it it didn't turn up.

1:00:52 Now, for all we know,

1:00:55 I don't know who the fourth pick or the fifth pick of the draft will be.

1:00:58 For all we know, they may take

1:01:01 that 30 number 31 pick that they have or the 30 2031 pick that they have

1:01:05 and put it with something else and end

1:01:06 up getting another player in the next year.

1:01:10 Sure.

1:01:09 And it may it may work out.

1:01:10 But um what he was basically saying is you may say to me, "Well,

1:01:15 why didn't you protect the pick to 7 8 10?" And he's like,

1:01:19 "I couldn't have gotten Zubots for that price." Yeah.

1:01:21 Because then because then then there's like no point because

1:01:24 the Clippers like we're not going to get that pick.

1:01:26 That's right.

1:01:27 And that's why they got Zubots because again,

1:01:29 he is a good player who allows them to stay out of the tax.

1:01:33 As for the Clippers, you know, the whole at some point here,

1:01:36 we're going to have the aspiration thing come down.

1:01:38 It's very difficult to know what their pathway

1:01:40 forward is until we find that out.

1:01:43 Um, but this, you know, this pick will enable them to continue their reset.

1:01:50 It's going to be very interesting to see what they do.

1:01:53 I mean, the the the the draft, there's those top four guys.

1:01:56 It's probably going to be one of Peterson and Debansa.

1:01:59 Then it's probably going to be one of Boozer and Wilson.

1:02:02 And then there's four or five guards in a row.

1:02:06 uh whatever order you want to put them in.

1:02:08 Darius Auff from Arkansas,

1:02:10 Katon Waggler from Illinois, Mikuel Brown from Louisville,

1:02:14 uh Kingston Flemings from Houston, Braden Burries from Arizona.

1:02:18 Those are probably the next five picks.

1:02:20 Maybe Nate Men, who's a a big wing from Tennessee.

1:02:23 All those guys are freshman, but those guards are probably going to be

1:02:26 at least three or four of those next picks.

1:02:28 And the Clippers just traded for Darius Garland back

1:02:32 in for James Harden back at the trade deadline.

1:02:35 That's a bit of an interesting fit going forward.

1:02:37 We'll see what they decide to do there.

1:02:39 But certainly for a team that's bereft of young talent and is starting to pivot

1:02:45 another way to turn Zubots into the fifth pick in this draft when we were back

1:02:50 in November talking about well hell are the Clippers going to be a not like

1:02:55 out of the playin kind of playoff team and give the Thunder a top 10 pick,

1:02:59 a top five pick, a top I mean they were six and 21 at one point.

1:03:04 So for them to for their pick to end up at 12 and for them

1:03:07 to get the fifth pick in the draft coming out of this season,

1:03:10 obviously Zoo is a very good player and they traded him to get it.

1:03:13 But that it is a pretty nice win for them

1:03:16 to start to pivot things in another direction as you

1:03:18 said as we wait to see whatever is going

1:03:20 to happen if it ever does with the aspiration stuff.

1:03:23 Well, and then there's also like we'll see what happens

1:03:26 with aspiration assuming they are allowed to attempt to negotiate an extension.

1:03:32 I believe the intention is to try to negotiate an extension with Kawhi Leonard,

1:03:37 but negotiate is a key word there.

1:03:39 It's not just like, hey, can you take just a little slight haircut from Maxis?

1:03:43 Like, and so depending on how that goes,

1:03:46 like there's a world where Kawhi could be on the on the block this summer, too.

1:03:51 So, we shall see.

1:03:53 Yeah.

1:03:53 Well, that this was a huge moment for the Clippers

1:03:56 and and and also and the chair the Thunder pick didn't move up.

1:04:01 So, Yeah, but that doesn't mean the Thunder can't move up higher if they want.

1:04:05 I understand that.

1:04:06 But if the Clippers didn't get the pick

1:04:07 and the Thunder pick also moved into the top four.

1:04:10 Oh, yes.

1:04:11 Imagine if the Pacers are picking third and the Thunder were picking fourth.

1:04:13 That would feel a lot differently for the old Clips.

1:04:15 Now the Thunder just have to find the next Jayen

1:04:17 Williams with the 12th pick that they got from the Clippers.

1:04:20 Um, all right.

1:04:20 I know the Cavs corner won, but it's late and they have another game tomorrow.

1:04:24 We're going to have time to talk about Cav's Corner because the lake

1:04:27 show is probably going the same way that the Sixers show went today tomorrow.

1:04:33 So, there'll be plenty of time to talk about Spurs Thunder

1:04:37 and or Spurs Wolves and Cows Pistons later in the week.

1:04:41 Sam Prey did not have any luck.

1:04:42 Um, but he was coming there from his team being up 3 in a series.

1:04:47 There was nobody else in that room who was Hey, also poor Sam Prey.

1:04:51 He's coming fresh off of watching a guy

1:04:53 he picked in the second round who started

1:04:55 his career on a two-way contract last year

1:04:57 completely dominate the Lakers in a playoff game.

1:05:00 Talking about AJ Mitchell, who by the way since he's been

1:05:03 in the starting lineup has averaged about 20 per game.

1:05:06 Uh, you know, filling in for the lottery pick who they got from the Clippers,

1:05:10 Jaylen Williams, who was an all NBA player on a championship team last year.

1:05:14 Sam will be all right.

1:05:15 It is just worth saying the last four guys we talked about Vita Zubot,

1:05:19 Kawhai Leonard, uh Jaylen Williams, and AJ Mitchell.

1:05:24 As you said, Mitchell and Zubot were second round picks.

1:05:26 Kawawaii was picked at 15, Jayla Mitchell was picked at 12.

1:05:29 RJ Williams was picked at 12.

1:05:30 Obviously, there's a ton of interest in the top of the draft,

1:05:33 and these guys at the top of the draft this year are particularly really good.

1:05:36 But as we've seen over and over again, there's talent all throughout the draft.

1:05:39 It is not a perfect science.

1:05:41 And just cuz one of these teams didn't get the top pick today doesn't

1:05:44 mean they're not going to line up with the best player in the draft.

1:05:46 Yeah.

1:05:46 And the Nets the Nets were super bummed.

1:05:49 But the sixth pick in this draft is a very good pick.

1:05:54 Yes.

1:05:53 Well, and and also like listen, there's the scouting aspect of it and then

1:05:58 there's the player development aspect of it.

1:06:01 Sometimes that part's as or more as much or more important.

1:06:04 I was talking to an agent courtside uh before

1:06:07 Lakers uh Thunder game three who was just talking

1:06:10 about like dude the Thunder like they don't get

1:06:13 enough credit for their player development side of things.

1:06:15 You talk about I mean think about some

1:06:17 of the guys they have making massive impacts.

1:06:19 AJ Mitchell, Lou Dort was undrafted.

1:06:22 Um I mean I think the Thunder get plenty credit for their player development.

1:06:26 I'll just I say that with love.

1:06:28 They they they are they are the model organization.

1:06:31 Kase Wallace.

1:06:33 He was a lottery though.

1:06:34 But yeah, true.

1:06:35 They got a ton of talent and they've also they I mean they do everything right.

1:06:38 That's why they're that's why they're

1:06:39 the heavy favorites to repeat as champions.

1:06:41 I thought it was cuz they got a bunch of whistles.

1:06:45 Yeah.

1:06:46 Well, I think uh I think they're I'm not going to get into that.

1:06:49 The band just out here jabbing out here jabbing.

1:06:52 Not taking the uh All right.

1:06:55 Um thank you to our producer Mark.

1:06:57 It was a big weekend for our producer Jackson.

1:07:00 Well, I was going to say, Jackson,

1:07:02 I was thought you were thought we were going to skip by it.

1:07:04 Jackson finally engaged.

1:07:07 Finally.

1:07:08 I'm not going to put any pressure on finally, but Jackson got engaged and um

1:07:14 he's like 21 years old.

1:07:16 The photos one I've never seen the photo

1:07:18 that we saw of Jackson after his engagement.

1:07:20 It was the happiest.

1:07:22 He looked extremely happy in the photo.

1:07:23 That made me happy.

1:07:25 Well, we never see him happy because we kind of make his life difficult.

1:07:28 got to deal.

1:07:29 He's got to deal with you.

1:07:30 Of course, he's not.

1:07:31 We kept him up till like 5 or 6:00 in the morning putting

1:07:34 the pod together the other night and then he got engaged like the next day.

1:07:37 Can you imagine that?

1:07:37 Like we were holding him up.

1:07:38 He was worried about privately.

1:07:40 Jackson had told us that there was a time limit and it was coming up.

1:07:42 So, I I had a feeling it was coming pretty soon.

1:07:44 I didn't know it was going to be Friday,

1:07:46 but uh but we are thrilled for Jackson and uh Nina is lovely bride to be.

1:07:51 We're both great.

1:07:53 Congratulations.

1:07:54 Um, she's better than he is, but yeah, she's got like a high level degree.

1:07:58 I didn't say she wasn't.

1:08:00 Yeah.

1:08:00 Um, Jack went to Syracuse.

1:08:02 She's got like a degree from Yale.

1:08:04 Um, all right.

1:08:05 Uh, thank you for listening and watching the Hoop Collective.

1:08:08 Thank you to McMahon and Bontemps.

1:08:09 We'll talk to you guys uh later this week after the next Wolves Spurs game.

1:08:14 God knows what's going to be going on on Tuesday night.

1:08:16 Fellas, let me show you how this is done.

1:08:19 Adios, amigos.