"Broke From Gooning!" Caleb Hammer Exposes The Purchases Destroying This Generation│Jack Neel

0:00 Today's guest is the most feared man in personal finance.

0:03 Dude, Gen Z men are losers.

0:05 Dating rates are record low.

0:06 Virginity rates are record high.

0:08 They're losers paying for Only Fans.

0:10 It kind of sucks cuz it's also just not hard to have sex.

0:13 A music kid from Michigan who went $70,000 in debt chasing a dream.

0:16 His life turned around when he became obsessed with financial education.

0:20 I turned 18.

0:21 I wanted a piano.

0:22 My parents said, "Oh, well,

0:22 go max out a credit card to get a piano." That was my first debt.

0:25 And that[ __] me for years to come.

0:27 Now he's built one of the most controversial shows on the internet,

0:30 auditing people's spending and calling out the habits keeping them broke.

0:33 Uh he was paying for an AI girlfriend behind her back.

0:35 He was all up in that chat.

0:36 He was like, "Come for me, baby." It wasn't like finance breaking,

0:39 but it was kind of relationship breaking.

0:41 In this episode, we'll expose the purchases quietly destroying Gen Z.

0:44 Explore why this generation feels like financial

0:46 freedom is impossible and investigate whether the system

0:49 is genuinely rigged or the problem is the person staring back in the mirror.

0:53 So the biggest lie is go to any institution,

0:56 borrow whatever it takes to get any degree [music] you want.

0:59 We need to be much more intentional with our students.

1:01 So college or double jaw surgery?

1:04 College.

1:04 Art degree or double jaw surgery?

1:07 Flip a coin.

1:08 Caleb Hammer, welcome to the Jack Noil podcast.

1:11 That was a That was a good little intro.

1:13 That [laughter] was exciting.

1:13 What is that accent?

1:14 I've never heard this.

1:15 The accent.

1:16 What are you?

1:17 I'm from uh Kentucky originally.

1:19 No, you're[ __] not.

1:20 That is some European ass[ __] [laughter] I get this all the time.

1:24 Probably isn't.

1:25 You got Where does it sound like I'm from in Europe?

1:27 I don't know.

1:28 That's why I'm asking.

1:29 People ask me if I'm like Australian, if I'm like British or something.

1:32 But

1:33 what's wrong with you?

1:34 [laughter] What is it?

1:36 [gasps]

1:36 I think I'm just I don't know, man.

1:39 Guys, comment down below.

1:41 Are you a hill boy?

1:42 A hill boy?

1:43 Hill boy.

1:43 Like the Kentucky Hills.

1:44 Oh, like the hillbillies.

1:46 No, no, no.

1:46 Like the hills.

1:47 Cuz they got like Appalachian Mountains.

1:49 Is that right?

1:49 Oh, yeah.

1:49 Yeah.

1:50 Yeah.

1:50 No.

1:51 I mean, my parents do sound like that, like they're straight up country.

1:54 But nice to meet you.

1:55 I really thought you were European, but thanks for having me, man.

1:58 I appreciate it.

1:59 Caleb, uh, I want to ask you,

2:01 you've sat down at this table across from hundreds of people,

2:05 many of which are in their 20s, looking at their income,

2:08 debt, spending, and the financial decisions they're making every day.

2:13 When you look at Gen Z as a whole

2:17 compared to other generations, how broke is Gen Z?

2:21 It's pretty bad.

2:22 Listen, I mean, a lot of the analytics

2:25 that we're getting around Gen Z are pretty brutal.

2:29 Uh especially with the rise of buy now pay later.

2:31 Like credit cards, that's already[ __] when it comes to millennials.

2:35 But with Gen Z's just as inclined with the credit cards,

2:38 but now they're adding the buy now pay later.

2:40 their student loans are even worse because the cost

2:43 of college keeps going up and we let anyone borrow

2:45 as much as they want for whatever degree at any

2:48 institution they want to go to, no questions asked.

2:51 Um, so student loans are brutal.

2:53 Uh, cost of living is brutal.

2:55 It's it seems to be getting worse every generation

2:58 from the boomers to now in three main categories.

3:02 And of course, debt being added on top of those, but that being housing,

3:07 school or education, and healthcare.

3:09 healthcare.

3:10 They're not having to super deal with yet on the overall generational level.

3:14 Of course, they have to u make their monthly payments and whatnot,

3:17 but in terms of they're obviously not a sick generation at this point,

3:20 but housing, school, the other big ones,

3:24 they're facing that facing that big burden where

3:27 it just keeps going up and not stopping.

3:29 It's not going to stop.

3:31 Not in the with with the way that the systems are currently set up.

3:34 So, it's pretty brutal.

3:35 They're brutal right now.

3:36 Now they're entering one of the worst job markets we've had in a long time.

3:40 I know like old millennials, they entered the job market in the great recession.

3:43 As a young millennial by like a year,

3:45 I'm lucky that I didn't enter the job market in the great recession.

3:49 But I I know the old millennials are young Gen Xers

3:52 like they I mean I wouldn't want to enter that job market.

3:55 That's brutal.

3:56 But Gen Z with the rise of AI right now, brutal job market.

4:00 companies just kind of holding hiring right now

4:02 because they don't know what the economy is

4:04 going to look like over the next year

4:05 or two and interest rates are still holding steady.

4:08 Not the best time to be graduating college.

4:11 So, I feel bad for them.

4:14 I mean, the average Genzy person has about

4:17 $400 in emergency savings is $94,000 in debt.

4:23 Statistics show it's the poorest most in debt generation in American history.

4:27 Yep.

4:28 Do you think Jinzy is incapable of saving money

4:31 and being financially responsible or do you think it's something else?

4:36 Not necessarily.

4:37 I mean, millennials didn't do well either until until they were in their 30s,

4:42 getting towards the height of their career for older millennials.

4:45 I mean, the oldest Gen Z's are still like a few years into their career.

4:50 We shouldn't expect that generation to be

4:52 anywhere like super successful right now.

4:54 But, I mean, you're right on the debt scale.

4:56 like student loans, the cost of college just keeps going up.

4:59 So, that is brutal.

5:01 But the cost of college isn't them not being able to save.

5:05 Them having these student loans now that they have to deal with, but I mean,

5:09 if if you see anyone in their from 18

5:11 to where what's the oldest Gen Z like 29 now?

5:15 That's usually not when people have savings.

5:17 They should, don't get me wrong.

5:19 I advocate for it.

5:20 I will help them get there, but 20s are often the times for[ __] up.

5:24 And we accept that as a society, maybe we shouldn't, but we do.

5:28 It's It's not surprising.

5:30 I don't think anyone's surprised.

5:32 If we're just being real about it, doesn't mean we should excuse it.

5:34 I'm not trying to enable it or excuse it by any means,

5:37 but I don't think we should all be like, "Oh, wow.

5:38 This is crazy.

5:40 I've never heard of this." I mean, it's it's every generation at 20 to 30.

5:44 And it's worse now because of those three categories that we talked about.

5:46 But even still, it's also worth recognizing that the cost of food

5:50 as a percentage of income in terms of groceries or the cost of entertainment,

5:54 anything else beyond those three categories

5:56 that I mentioned as a percentage of income

5:59 is actually lower now than at pretty much any point of human history.

6:04 So, Gen Z is very lucky when it comes to that.

6:07 But Jenz's exiting college right now in a bad job market,

6:13 meaning it's hard to get a good income right now while you're also having

6:17 to finally start paying on these student

6:18 loans that are higher now than other generations.

6:21 So that's just a bad double thing you're

6:24 having to deal with at the exact same time.

6:27 So it doesn't really matter if grocery spending is a lower

6:31 percentage of your income than previous generations when you have

6:33 to deal with like some of the two biggest things plus

6:36 cost of housing on top of it at the exact same time.

6:40 Right.

6:40 So those are some of the more like systemic uncontrollables.

6:44 Uh, but when it comes to like the personal responsibility degree portion,

6:48 like is there anything specific about I guess Jin's mindset,

6:52 their psychology that you see that they're worse at just this whole money thing?

6:57 The paying for certainly is enabling a lot of bad purchases,

7:01 making it look like you can afford something

7:03 that you can't going to Coachella this year.

7:05 You can get it for some smaller payments instead of onetime payment.

7:09 So, it's definitely enabled some pretty bad behavior.

7:11 You can do Afterpay on Coachella.

7:13 I'm sure you can.

7:14 you can do it on everything.

7:15 So going out getting your Uber Eats or Door Dash, doing it on CLA,

7:20 you know, it's it's a way to make it easier.

7:22 And they they grew up on those apps now, too.

7:24 So food delivery is much more of an expectation and considered

7:29 reasonable now than it would have been even when I was young.

7:32 You know, getting Jimmy John's delivered was a treat,

7:34 but I couldn't just go and get uh Shake Shack or Texas Roadhouse delivered.

7:40 But now it's it's considered more of an expectation.

7:43 And there is a responsibility part of whether how you do college.

7:48 But at the same time,

7:50 there's a lot of parents impact there when you first go to college,

7:54 where you're choosing what degree you're picking,

7:57 and how you're borrowing to pay for it or how you pay for it at all.

8:00 But still, I mean, once you're like halfway through, if you're 20,

8:03 you you're having conversations with professors,

8:05 advisors, you're making more friends.

8:07 you should if you're tweaking your major or choosing

8:11 where you're transferring or figuring out what you're spending,

8:14 how you're living in college, then you have a bit more personal responsibility.

8:18 So, I would advocate there is personal responsibility in school.

8:22 Maybe not right at 18, you know, like there is a little,

8:25 but I know you have a lot of heavy influence from your adviserss in high school

8:31 and your teachers in high school or everything

8:34 in our culture over the past few decades.

8:36 It's like rur college no matter what.

8:37 And college is great, do not get me wrong,

8:39 but people go and get the[ __] degrees.

8:41 And if you're at 20 and you're still getting the[ __] degree

8:44 at a private institution or even a public out of state institution,

8:47 whatever it is, and you're borrowing anything to get that[ __] degree,

8:50 the art, even psychology, honestly,

8:53 just so many degrees that right now, um,

8:57 when you actually kind of look into the wealth divide between even genders,

9:02 right, that 70 cents per on the dollar thing,

9:04 a lot of it comes down to even just the degrees.

9:07 when accounting for the same degree for the same job,

9:09 it's actually a two-cent divide, which is kind of curious.

9:13 So, with more women going to college now, uh, and men are just not men are going

9:18 into trade schools or they're being unemployed losers as well,

9:20 there's, uh, a big issue where people are

9:24 just still getting a lot of[ __] degrees.

9:26 And unfortunately, it is women.

9:27 I I do feel bad for that.

9:29 What would you say are the five most[ __] college degrees?

9:33 Five most[ __] Well, the arts thrive and I love arts.

9:37 I I mean, like your intro said, I went to school for music composition.

9:40 I was making money off of it because I had a business brain.

9:43 I mean, this is pulling out of my ass, right?

9:45 Because I don't have statistics on the actual what[ __] degrees,

9:48 but certainly like psychology is a classic one.

9:51 Uh, history, things that it's not that they're not

9:55 important or that we shouldn't have them in our society,

9:58 but way too many people are going to them that the market demands.

10:01 Like we need history researchers and whatnot.

10:04 We do, but more people want to do

10:06 it than is currently available in the marketplace.

10:10 Certainly the same can be said for art and psychology as well.

10:13 Now, if you go and you get your masters, you do all this, you do therapy,

10:15 you do social work, sure that's different,

10:17 but even social work doesn't necessarily have the best return on investment.

10:21 So unfortunately a lot of those people that go

10:23 to college and again the vast majority of people going

10:25 to college right now are women and men are

10:27 kind of falling behind and that's a whole different conversation.

10:31 Uh but a lot of the people that are going to college

10:33 in that larger percentage are getting[ __] degrees and it leads to worse wages

10:37 and you do not want to have a[ __] degree and a bad job

10:40 market when cost of housing and cost of getting that[ __] degree are higher.

10:45 If you were picking like a degree to get now

10:47 or like a skill to develop or how would you determine that?

10:51 Would you be looking at I guess going on LinkedIn

10:54 and seeing what companies are hiring and what the requirements are?

10:57 Like how would you go about it?

10:58 Maybe I have a little bit more of an anxious brain.

11:01 So AI is in the big conversation right now.

11:04 No one really knows what it's going to look like and I don't

11:06 listen to anyone who says they know what it's going to look like.

11:08 Like I don't know.

11:09 But if I am a little nervous, I want to be a little more AI resistant.

11:13 Nursing is incredible.

11:14 We got to get dudes in nursing.

11:17 It's not gay to be a nurse.

11:18 And there's nothing wrong with being gay, Jack.

11:20 [laughter] Okay, but still, go get go get a nursing degree.

11:25 Like, what what are we doing?

11:26 Why aren't guys getting into that?

11:28 Um, and then women into the trades would be awesome as well.

11:32 We need we need more of that.

11:33 And we need more men in social work.

11:35 Uh, I I want to see people getting into those degrees that are more

11:40 AI resistant at least cuz I don't

11:42 think they're taking over the trades anytime soon.

11:44 They still might.

11:45 I mean, you're going to get plumbers and electrician robots probably,

11:48 but it's not going to be doing a code base.

11:50 Right.

11:52 Right.

11:52 Or which is what AI is doing now, which is a lot easier.

11:55 Nursing, I don't think people are going to want a nurse robot.

11:58 Even if it is better, in the end,

12:00 I think you still want that human touch in that field.

12:03 banking, finance, yeah, you're gonna have AI integrated,

12:05 but there's such a heavy regulatory environment

12:08 that it might be more resistant to AI soon.

12:10 So, that's more protective.

12:12 [sighs] It was all engineering, engineering,

12:14 get into coding, everything like that.

12:16 And I think that it's still a good place to go, but hyper competitive.

12:21 The competitive landscape is it's completely different than it was 5 years ago.

12:25 5 years ago, they would hire anyone with any background to work in any kind

12:30 of coding or whatever because they just needed

12:33 that labor and they were chasing that labor.

12:35 But now where you can have one person working with AI

12:40 takes up what three people would have done a few years ago,

12:44 you have to be the best of the best now.

12:45 Can't be the junior guy.

12:47 Can't be the junior engineer.

12:49 So, I'd only go into that now if you know you're ready to fight for it.

12:54 And if you fight for it and win, you make a lot of money, don't get me wrong.

12:58 But it's not that perfect,

13:00 easy solution to get an incredible job and career as it was even 5 years ago.

13:05 In security, we'll see with cyber security.

13:07 Cyber security has always been a safe one.

13:09 We need cyber security.

13:10 But now with mythos right now, it's poking holes in cyber security,

13:14 but I think they're meant to be

13:16 using it as eventually defense in cyber security.

13:18 And we'll see how humans get involved on that.

13:20 Maybe that's the next industry to go.

13:22 So, would you recommend content creation for the average person?

13:26 I mean, just kind of like music, right?

13:28 Um, for the average person, no.

13:32 I think music, content creation, the arts, anything like that, acting,

13:37 it's going to be the small minority that make it

13:42 and often times it's the people who are willing to sacrifice everything.

13:45 Um, but yes, I I suggest everyone if they have

13:48 a passion in it to do it on the side.

13:51 I did this on the side.

13:54 Do it on the side and give your all to it on the side.

13:57 And if it starts to take off, then go to it full-time.

14:01 But if you're going to like Fullale University

14:03 and spending $100,000 on that or whatever it is,

14:06 I know that place is expensive to get a degree in how to man a camera,

14:11 it's it's not the best return on investment.

14:15 I want people to We need the arts.

14:17 We need the arts.

14:18 I want people to be in the arts.

14:19 I want people to be in media,

14:21 but more people want to do it than the market demands.

14:24 So, you have to be the best.

14:25 You have to be a killer.

14:27 You have to be dedicated and willing to do anything.

14:29 And a lot of time people just have a trouble even starting and or if they start,

14:33 they don't maintain.

14:33 They don't learn.

14:35 Um, but started on the side.

14:37 You know, I still write music on the side,

14:39 but I don't pursue any commercial avenues with that.

14:41 And that was just for fun.

14:42 And maybe someday if I ever wanted to get

14:44 music performed again in the concert band world,

14:46 I could start pursuing that on the side,

14:48 but I wouldn't just all of a sudden quit

14:49 this and do that cuz that just wouldn't make any sense.

14:53 Would you say that's more of your passion than what you do now?

14:56 No, I wouldn't say so.

14:57 But it's still fun.

14:58 I have a a good time doing it.

14:59 It's It's rare to do it.

15:01 It's like a couple hours a weekend or something.

15:04 Yeah.

15:05 It's just it's interesting to me because

15:07 I think people assume that like content creators

15:10 or anyone that works in a creative field loves what they do all the time,

15:14 but it's like at the end of the day this can turn into like a 9

15:18 to5 to an extent because you have to maintain

15:21 a certain set of actions and a certain set of consistency.

15:24 Um, and there's like you're not going to love all parts of the job.

15:26 So, it's not always as sexy as people think it is.

15:29 You know,

15:29 I don't think anyone I don't think you can love all parts of the job.

15:32 Like, every crazy politician with unlimited ambition wants to become president.

15:38 I don't think it's considered like a job with no stress, though, or bad moments.

15:41 Like, this job's incredible.

15:43 It's the best job in the world.

15:44 I wouldn't give it up for anything.

15:45 Doesn't mean there's bad moments.

15:47 you know, people you all of a sudden become this weird thing online

15:50 where people try to create[ __] or stir[ __] up and or you know,

15:55 toxic communities and a lot like there's bad things

15:57 and I have to completely hide my girlfriend's identity

16:00 because there's crazy people out there and you have

16:02 to be afraid of doxing or swatting things like this.

16:04 Um, so there's negatives and um,

16:08 but overall it's still the best job in the world for me.

16:13 Might not be for someone else.

16:14 someone else's perfect job might not be my perfect job.

16:17 Um, but yeah, even with even with the downsides

16:20 and I've certainly turned it more to a nineto-ive business,

16:23 we've grown here, but it's still pretty damn great, right?

16:29 Very, very blessed.

16:30 Very blessed to be clear.

16:33 I do want to touch on uh the actual expenses of some of the guests on your show.

16:39 So most of the guests are millennials, Gen Z, sometimes older,

16:45 but when you look at their bank statements as far as the micro purchases,

16:50 like how is Gen Z spending money differently?

16:52 Like what are the traps keeping them broke?

16:56 What I've seen in some of our older guests is that they worked for 10 years,

17:00 15 years, and now they're like, "Okay,

17:02 I've I I I've put in the work I deserve going

17:05 on vacation." We're getting people who've

17:07 gotten their first job outside of college,

17:08 have $70,000 of student loan debt, just got their first car loan,

17:11 and they're like, "Okay, I got my first job.

17:12 First thing I could do is go on vacation." So,

17:14 they go on vacations immediately and they go on two a year,

17:16 they have to go to Europe, they have to go to Japan,

17:18 they have to do all these things.

17:19 They're not even going to California or whatever.

17:21 They're going overseas.

17:23 They're doing these big trips just because they hit

17:25 the first job milestone and they finance it as always.

17:28 They put it all on a credit card or paying for as much as they can.

17:32 Um, there is the college piece that we talked about.

17:36 People have an enormous student loan burden,

17:38 but with the repayment assistance program,

17:41 you can get a if you don't have a great job right out of college.

17:44 First of all, there are deferrals,

17:46 but even besides that, you can get it as low as 1% of your income.

17:49 So, but people don't know about the options out there.

17:52 So, people start getting hammered with the student loans.

17:56 People get a job, they think it's going to be a lot more money,

17:58 it stretches a lot further.

17:59 they have to have their first place on their own or even with roommates,

18:02 you know, maybe it's their first time moving out of their parents house.

18:04 It's a lot of that adult[ __] hitting for the first

18:07 time in their life and that income [clears throat] doesn't

18:09 stretch as far as a lot of them think it is

18:11 and yet they need to go get a vacation as well.

18:14 Like I want people to be able to experience

18:17 the world and do the things they want to.

18:19 There is an importance of just getting your[ __] together first.

18:24 Having an emergency fund so you're not[ __] when your car breaks down

18:29 or when you get fired and you still need to pay your rent.

18:33 That's they they rush they rush beyond that point.

18:36 But again, I think every generation does when they are in that 20s to 30s.

18:40 This is everyone uses the excuse on the show and I hate it.

18:43 It was like no one taught me about money.

18:45 No one teaches anyone about money.

18:47 I didn't get I didn't learn anything about money.

18:50 You have to teach yourself.

18:51 You have to figure it out.

18:52 But also, it is the standard thing right outside of college.

18:55 You finally make money with your job.

18:57 You want to do something.

18:58 And now with the Instagram and the Tik Tok and the YouTube communities,

19:03 everyone posting their lifestyles,

19:04 there's more of that jealousy and wanting to mimic it and get the new clothes,

19:08 get the new car, go on the trip.

19:10 So, lots of that instant gratification that Gen Z views as adulthood

19:17 that you can just do the moment you get your job.

19:19 And maybe people have waited a little longer.

19:22 I guess when you think of like your last

19:24 50 people you've had on, like is there always

19:26 consistent transactions that are like new within the last

19:30 10 years that like it's it's the Uber Eats,

19:33 it's the Coachella, like what are some of the other things?

19:36 Food delivery is a huge one, right?

19:37 Food delivery is a huge one.

19:38 I mean, honestly, you know, the show's turning four here soon.

19:45 Even at the beginning, I was getting less of it.

19:47 Like, I know Uber Eats and Door Dash was ramping up around that time,

19:51 but I was still getting a lot less.

19:53 Getting a lot more Tik Tok shop now as well.

19:57 Really tons of Tik Tok shop.

19:57 It's so easy cuz every other Tik Tok you see is an ad for something

20:02 and people just click and it's it's to their door in a few days.

20:05 So, a lot of Tik Tok shop.

20:07 It's those it's those small purchases that they don't think amount to anything,

20:10 but they do a couple of them a day or a lot

20:13 of them a week and it adds up to a lot.

20:15 Hey, quick question.

20:16 Have you ever used Bitcoin or Ethereum to purchase anything in real life?

20:21 Like, sure, you might have it sitting in a wallet.

20:23 You trade it sometimes or send it to friends,

20:25 but you're not able to actually buy anything in real life.

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20:45 But the best part to me is you don't have

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21:16 Click the link in the description and check out EtherFi.

21:19 Grab the cash card and take advantage

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21:23 Spend like you normally would, just get rewarded for it.

21:26 But anyway, guys, back to the podcast.

21:29 Do you think cars are a big problem with Jinzy?

21:32 It's a big problem for any American generation.

21:34 We're a car dependent infrastructure nation.

21:37 It's[ __] I mean, it[ __] sucks if I'm being completely honest.

21:41 And cars are brutally expensive now more than ever,

21:45 especially after the pandemic.

21:46 During the pandemic, it just got brutal and it really never came back down.

21:49 You can still get a used car, but even still,

21:52 the what used to be a $2,000 car when I started the show is a $10,000 car now.

21:57 So, you're not getting a clunker that breaks down immediately.

21:59 And even with that, you still need to get it checked out by multiple mechanics.

22:02 But it it's a big issue because it's a weird cycle.

22:05 We are unless you're blessed to live

22:07 in a rare few communities where you can walk,

22:11 bike, or even maybe take public transportation to a job.

22:14 You need a car to have a job,

22:16 but you need a job to have a car because cars are expensive.

22:19 And that's that weird cycle where it's like, what do you do first?

22:21 And either people get into a predatory loan to have a usable

22:24 car so they can get a job to pay off the predatory loan,

22:27 or they get a[ __] car that always breaks down to get a job,

22:29 but then they're using all their income

22:31 from their job to pay for all the repairs

22:33 and crap and maintenance on their[ __] car just so they can get to their job.

22:36 And it's it's brutal.

22:39 The car situation in this country is brutal.

22:41 And it is such a trap.

22:43 And people feel like I swear the amount of justifications

22:46 I get on my show for I need the new car,

22:50 the 2027 model, the safety.

22:52 I care about my safety.

22:53 Safety, the kids, the dogs, the wife, the whatever.

22:56 I'm confused.

22:57 Were we making cars that literally just like whipped out

22:59 a gun and shot you in the face 10 years ago?

23:01 Were we making cars that the moment

23:04 you got into any troublesome situation blew up?

23:07 We were not making hardcore dangerous cars.

23:09 I'm not saying go get a 90s car or even 2000's car,

23:12 but getting a 2019 car isn't the worst thing in the world,

23:16 18,1 17, whatever it is.

23:18 So, I mean, there's a lot of cope around

23:20 cars having to get the more expensive new car,

23:23 the safety ratings and[ __] that they pay for anyway, allegedly.

23:27 But with that crap, I mean,

23:28 it's such a it's a great marketing gimmick and people fall for it.

23:32 People fall for it.

23:34 It's brutal.

23:34 Well, people don't understand loans and interest and all

23:40 that stuff when they're getting their first car.

23:42 I definitely did it when I got my first car loan.

23:44 And that was one of my big brutal loans I had to pay

23:46 off when I finally started to wake up to personal finances was my car.

23:50 And people will borrow their down payment, too,

23:52 cuz they'll do whatever it takes to get the car that they justify

23:55 with their cope to get that they need a brand new car for.

23:59 Do you think it's the middle class trying

24:01 to project their wealth by getting a new car?

24:04 Like what's the mindset?

24:05 Part of it is.

24:06 And is it the middle class mainly that like does

24:08 this phenomenon of getting like cars way out of their price range?

24:13 Have you been to a poor community?

24:18 With those uh dude, go to a white trash community,

24:22 you'll see all these lifted $100,000 trucks.

24:27 Really?

24:26 A poor a white trash trailer.

24:28 Absolutely.

24:29 Go to uh the opposite side of it.

24:31 go to like a poor uh black community or something,

24:35 you'll get lots of muscle cars and[ __] that are completely decked out.

24:38 Go to like a poor Mexican community.

24:40 I I went through uh one of the neighborhoods uh recently

24:43 that is like a classic like definitely down on its luck more

24:47 Hispanic community here and everyone had these sexy cars that are bouncing

24:51 with these spikes off their uh I don't know what they're called,

24:54 but they're like spikes off the

24:56 the wheels.

24:57 Yeah.

24:57 Off the wheels, but I don't know what those are called,

24:59 but that shit's expensive, man.

25:00 So, no.

25:01 I uh it's very American at least or American Canadian Australian where it's

25:06 like that big suburban sprawl car infrastructure

25:09 type countries and societies we live in.

25:12 But no, I mean yeah the middle class do it but everyone does it to flex.

25:16 Such car culture.

25:17 So many people I know in my own life

25:19 would prefer having a nice car over a nice house.

25:21 I don't know what it is.

25:22 Luckily I don't give a[ __] I guess I'm lucky on that.

25:25 But if I did, in the position I'm lucky enough to find myself

25:28 in, I'd probably be a[ __][ __] Just getting like a Lamborghini, whatever.

25:33 I don't even know.

25:34 I don't know what's nice.

25:35 I don't know.

25:36 I know Lamborghini is a nice brand,

25:37 but I'd get something stupid cuz just Americans love that.

25:41 And it's such a status symbol,

25:42 and people care what the person next to you

25:44 at the stoplight thinks about you when they look over.

25:48 It's such a weird thing.

25:49 So, from the poorest communities,

25:52 the middle class to even the wealthiest communities.

25:54 And we were talking about Togei before filming.

25:57 That dude's a dumbass with his cars.

25:59 I love him.

26:01 Honestly, super nice dude, but he's a[ __] dumbass with his cars.

26:05 What is he doing Rolls-Royce and all this stuff, losing cars and coin flips?

26:10 This is This is He lost his house in a coin flip as well.

26:13 I know.

26:14 It's ridiculous.

26:15 This is just what people do in our culture.

26:17 Cars are such a thing.

26:18 Such an accessory.

26:20 I've never got it.

26:20 I can't even speak to it because like I I

26:22 haven't owned a car since I was like 15 years old.

26:24 I I've Uber.

26:25 Do you live in LA?

26:26 Yeah.

26:26 I Uber everywhere.

26:28 Oh, okay.

26:29 It's expensive.

26:29 I mean, that's just as bad as a car payment, if not worse sometimes.

26:32 You think so?

26:33 Well, it definitely is.

26:35 My justification for it, and this is going to sound like cope,

26:37 is I work in the Uber.

26:40 Well, your justification is you can probably afford it.

26:42 It's fine if you can afford it.

26:44 That's fair.

26:44 But like I I don't care what anyone does if they can afford it and it's legal.

26:48 Do you see a lot of people spending on Ubers or is that Oh yeah.

26:51 No, it's huge.

26:52 It's huge.

26:53 Even when they have their own car, but honestly,

26:54 a lot of it is usually in that vacation trip or when it's certainly justified.

26:59 Even if you can't afford it, if you know they're drinking, you got to Uber home.

27:04 And very fair.

27:06 I will never yell at them for that.

27:08 Another issue too, I guess, would be just like lack of car pooling.

27:11 You know, like people could save so much money just by having

27:14 a friend that has a car and they go to the same place.

27:17 Sit in traffic.

27:17 Look at the car next to you.

27:18 It's one person in it.

27:19 It's brutal and takes up so much space for just one person.

27:23 It's[ __] [clears throat]

27:24 What can you tell about someone's finances by what kind of car they drive?

27:29 Honestly, I just assume even with like nice clothes,

27:32 the nicer people have, I assume the worse they're off.

27:36 I really do.

27:37 It's just it's a thing in our culture.

27:40 I mean, look at all the the wealthiest people in Silicon

27:42 Valley and wealthiest people in Austin in these kind of cultures.

27:45 It also it certainly depends on what city you live in, right?

27:48 Because I know like Miami or LA, it's more flashy,

27:50 but um the most successful people here in Silicon Valley and other places,

27:55 they're just dress like wherever.

27:58 Like I mean, I do very well.

28:00 I don't own this is the nicest thing I've ever

28:02 purchased that isn't a car just because cars are naturally expensive.

28:05 Yeah.

28:06 It's a couple thousand bucks and I did it cuz my girlfriend said I had to.

28:09 [laughter] So like it's I don't know.

28:13 I swear it is it is a cope.

28:16 It is a psych it is a psychology.

28:18 People see it on Instagram and Tik Tok and they want that nice

28:21 thing and they will do whatever it takes unaffordable to get that nice thing.

28:27 But look at the people who are doing well off unless they

28:30 are that weird flashy[ __] like trying to jerk off around everyone.

28:34 They're around in town.

28:37 It's just

28:39 Is it a bigger issue with girls or guys or is it same across the board?

28:43 The car thing.

28:44 H cars, dudes for sure, right?

28:47 I'd say cars.

28:48 Dudes for sure.

28:49 And clothing and accessories probably women a bit more.

28:52 But I mean, it still falls in both categories.

28:54 You know, you get your girly pop SUV, but it's still a Lamborghini or a Porsche.

29:00 Uh, and you can get your bling as a guy, designer clothes, all that crap.

29:06 Dude, I think I'm wearing Teimu shorts right now.

29:08 Like I'm

29:09 like I think I don't know.

29:10 It's just some crap.

29:12 How much does this fit cost?

29:13 I don't know what this is.

29:14 This was for branding cuz like

29:16 the best budgeting app there is other dollar-wise.

29:18 So, I'm wearing it for that.

29:20 It's making me money.

29:21 Then I got Teeu and uh I don't know, some white shirt under.

29:24 Have you ever bought anything off Teeu?

29:26 I just No, I mean it's not actually Teeu, but it's like that quality.

29:28 It's that cheap.

29:29 It's It's nothing.

29:31 Um, actually, no, no, no, no.

29:33 These are like nicer shoes that What is it?

29:35 O, whatever that brand is.

29:38 Super comfy, though.

29:39 I always see a bunch of like really wealthy guys that I have

29:42 on my podcast wearing these just like

29:44 shoes that you can tell are really comfortable,

29:46 but they're not like flashy, you know?

29:47 It's just like utility based.

29:49 No, I mean, my entire intent literally I dress

29:51 to go on like a three mile walk after this.

29:52 That's what I dressed [laughter] for.

29:54 That was my I'm just going to take this off and go on a walk.

29:56 Perfect.

29:56 Awesome.

29:58 Um, what's the most money you've seen someone waste on food delivery apps?

30:03 Delivery apps.

30:04 Oo.

30:04 Oh, we usually tally as just going out to eat in general.

30:08 Like I I've had it's very standard to see someone making $40,000 a year

30:13 spend 1,500 bucks and in their single previous month going out to eat.

30:18 Many of that being food deliveries or also just going out to eat.

30:22 But it's that is not considered unreasonable on the show.

30:26 So it's like half their income essentially.

30:28 Oh yeah.

30:28 Half, a third, even more than that because people almost every single guest,

30:33 95% of the guests that come on financial

30:35 audit spend more per month than they make.

30:38 So it doesn't even matter if it's half their income cuz it's

30:40 not half their spending still because they just put it on debt.

30:43 They're funding with a personal loan or credit

30:46 cards or even pulling from their 401k.

30:49 Just really bad things.

30:50 So that is not an odd or a rare thing to see.

30:56 on financial audit.

30:57 Would you say that your show like the guest

30:59 on your show's expenses are an accurate representation of the average person?

31:04 Because I mean obviously you're a content creator.

31:06 You could have um siphon out people who have like more interesting stories,

31:10 but would you guess that if we took random person off the street right now just

31:14 outside uh at a coffee shop or something

31:17 like would they be in a similar situation?

31:19 Would you guess?

31:20 Well, statistically from like what you said,

31:23 it actually lines up in terms of like how much they have in savings,

31:26 like a couple hundred bucks.

31:27 Like a Gen Z person on the show.

31:29 Uh the amount of debt in student loans, it's actually very normal.

31:32 So, we actually have a disproportionate amount

31:35 of people on the show who have a mortgage, like a higher percentage

31:39 of people than do in the real world.

31:42 So, it's kind of weird where sometimes we'll get

31:46 more pe people with more money in their retirement,

31:48 but they're still blowing insane amount of money.

31:50 So, we we look for you have to financially qualify to be on the show, right?

31:55 You need to have a place to improve on.

31:57 So, we definitely have the like you could pick

31:59 someone off the street and have very similar finances,

32:02 but then we make sure we're picking interesting stories in unique situations.

32:06 I mean, they're everywhere.

32:07 These are your neighbors.

32:08 These are getting hundreds of applications a day.

32:11 These are your neighbors, your co-workers, your family members.

32:14 It's a taboo topic, right?

32:16 Personal finances.

32:17 No one really knows what's going on in most people's lives.

32:18 We don't talk about income, debt, spending in this country.

32:22 We just show vacations on Instagram.

32:24 Yeah.

32:24 It seemed, this might have just been unique to my situation growing up.

32:28 I just never knew like how much money my parents made or like how much they had.

32:32 Like would you say that's fairly typical for people?

32:34 Yeah, I didn't really know.

32:35 I mean, I asked questions when we were receiving like foreclosure notices.

32:39 Like I learned a little more there, but no, not really.

32:43 And the things that I got to do,

32:45 which were I had a very blessed childhood, but it was all in debt, right?

32:49 I got to do cool things, but it was all on debt.

32:53 So, but I didn't know that.

32:54 I didn't know that until I was older and we

32:55 had those conversations when I was in college or whatever.

32:59 So, no, I didn't have those conversations and I

33:01 really don't think we do in this country.

33:03 Actually, the parents on the show specifically say

33:05 they don't want their kids to know, right?

33:07 It's embarrassing.

33:09 That makes sense.

33:10 Is there any one purchase you've seen recently

33:12 that you actively think about after you leave the show?

33:16 Like you kind of tell everyone about it and like you're like,

33:18 I I actually can't believe that this person bought this thing.

33:21 Yes.

33:22 A guy with a girl with a wife.

33:24 Wife or girlfriend?

33:24 Fiance.

33:25 One of those situations.

33:26 They definitely been together for a while.

33:28 Uh he was paying for an AI girlfriend behind her back.

33:33 Wasn't great.

33:34 Shouldn't do that.

33:36 And he was gooning to her, too.

33:37 He was all up in that chat goon and he was like, "Come for me, baby.

33:42 Make no mistakes." You know, it's like,

33:44 [laughter] "Why are we doing that when she's right there?" And then

33:48 she found that on the show and it was awkward moment.

33:52 And that still sits with me even two or three weeks after filming, right?

33:56 What are we doing?

33:57 Then he tried to hide it from her.

33:58 It was just Oh, it was so crazy.

34:00 I got him to log in.

34:02 I went through the messages.

34:03 He showed you the messages.

34:05 Oh, yeah.

34:06 It wasn't on his no list.

34:07 People get to say what they do not

34:09 want included in the conversations before they film.

34:12 That wasn't one of them.

34:13 How much had he spent on his AI girlfriend?

34:15 Uh, it was like like 25 bucks a month.

34:19 It wasn't like like finance breaking,

34:23 but it was kind of relationship breaking and it was also just stupid money.

34:26 What pointless there's a woman right there.

34:28 There's a woman of be don't remember if she was beautiful,

34:32 but beautiful to some one woman right there.

34:34 And why couldn't they just do things together?

34:37 I don't know.

34:38 Would you say that's common?

34:39 Like the uh I I guess expenses for men specifically.

34:44 Uh oh, we got OAF like crazy, my guy.

34:47 We got OF like crazy on these men's accounts.

34:50 And like I said, people can say what not to talk about.

34:52 You can you can assume if I have a single guy on the show

34:56 and we're going through his statements and I don't bring up OAF,

35:00 OAF is there and he said not to talk about it.

35:02 So, we didn't.

35:04 But you can assume most guys have OF these days.

35:07 It's kind of crazy.

35:10 So, OAF, would you say sports betting is another one?

35:13 I actually don't get a lot of that surprising.

35:15 Like, we we do get betters.

35:16 And when we do get betters, they go, you know, they bet a lot,

35:21 but it's it's actually a small minority still of guests on the show,

35:25 but when they do, they go crazy.

35:27 when they're into any kind of gambling,

35:28 whether that's even just ripping Pokemon packs or whatever it is,

35:33 if they get into any kind of gambling,

35:35 it becomes hundreds to thousands of dollars,

35:37 but it's still I think people know to avoid it overall,

35:40 but man, when you're in it, you're in it and it's bad.

35:44 I And I I I played with Khi.

35:46 I had some fun.

35:47 [laughter] I had some fun.

35:48 And honestly, I'm not against those programs.

35:50 I like Cali and Poly Market.

35:52 It's hard for me to be against them, too,

35:54 because they seem a little bit more predictable at the least.

35:57 You know what I mean?

35:58 I think I think anything like that with a drink or smoking weed or anything.

36:02 I'm good with it if you can control it.

36:04 If you know you can't, you need to selfban, right?

36:08 So, I actually like them.

36:09 I mean, they were more accurate in the last election than the polling.

36:13 So, I like them.

36:14 They're very fun to play around with.

36:16 I had fun with the Super Bowl,

36:17 but all of a sudden, I'm not on them for every game.

36:19 I had fun with the Super Bowl.

36:20 That was it.

36:21 I know how to control myself.

36:22 So like I would I would even I wouldn't even be

36:24 opposed to them as like even working with them on a project.

36:28 Like I wouldn't because same with their credit card.

36:30 I love credit cards.

36:32 I love debt.

36:33 I love a lot of these things that we rail against

36:37 on the show because it's not for the for the person on the show.

36:41 It's not for the person.

36:42 There are still good things out there.

36:44 If you can self-modderate and you can have fun with it, then I'm not against it.

36:48 People think I'm against all these things.

36:50 I had someone compare.

36:51 They said, "Kailed hammer's the new avocado toast for Gen Z." I'm like,

36:54 "No, get your[ __] avocado toast.

36:55 Get your Door Dash.

36:56 Get your Uber.

36:58 I don't care if you can afford it and you

37:00 have a fully funded emergency fund and you don't have

37:02 this horrendous 30% debt o hanging over your life

37:05 that is controlling every decision and every aspect of your future.

37:09 If you don't, then do whatever.

37:11 Gamble, have fun in moderation.

37:13 There's nothing wrong with that." Have you ever thought about how many

37:16 different software subscriptions you're using to run

37:19 your business or social media channels?

37:22 Because if you're like me,

37:23 you're probably doing email marketing on one platform,

37:25 you're running your website on another platform,

37:28 customer support/CRM somewhere else,

37:31 and you're spending thousands of dollars a month on all these tools,

37:34 and you barely can keep track of all of it.

37:36 That's why I was so glad our team started using Highle.

37:39 It's basically the operating system for our entire business all in one place.

37:44 But the craziest part is their AI studio.

37:46 Anything you want to add to your business, new website, better funnel,

37:50 automations, it builds it out instantly simply by typing in a prompt.

37:54 Now, be honest with me.

37:55 Are you currently paying more than $97 a month

37:58 to keep track of your leads in a CRM, send automated emails and text messages,

38:03 build landing pages, and process payments?

38:06 If you said yes, you're probably going to want to switch to High Level.

38:10 So seriously, if you want to stop paying

38:11 for eight different software subscriptions to run your business,

38:14 just go to jackneil.com/highlevel or scan the QR code on screen.

38:19 Again, that is jackneil.com/highle if you want

38:23 to run your entire business with one platform.

38:27 But anyway, guys, back to the podcast.

38:30 I guess when you think about those micro expenses of men,

38:33 uh like what would you say are the top

38:35 five ones that are new to like this genie?

38:38 Gooning for sure.

38:38 It's a big one.

38:40 Definitely.

38:41 Gooning.

38:42 Um, micro purchases.

38:44 Did you say specifically micro?

38:46 Okay.

38:46 Because I wanted to throw cars in there, but um Oh, gooning for sure.

38:51 So, lots of collections and they don't just stick to one platform.

38:55 I I know, but there's there's I'm blanking on the other ones.

38:59 As a professional gooner,

39:00 I'm a little disappointed that I'm forgetting the other uh platforms,

39:04 but you you'll see all of them.

39:05 If you see one, you'll see the other ones.

39:08 Um, man, micro purchase.

39:10 I mean, everyone goes out to eat.

39:12 That's not really a gender thing, though.

39:13 The Is that one?

39:16 No,

39:17 I I would actually say uh less on that, but vaping is a crossgenerational thing.

39:22 I don't see a lot of uh I mean,

39:25 that's one reason we partnered with Gamer Subs was because men do love

39:29 to go into the gas station and get energy drinks on the way to work.

39:32 That's a very common thing.

39:34 Women love to go to the Starbies.

39:35 Men love to get the Celsius or Monster or whatever.

39:39 Yeah.

39:39 See, I mean, which is good.

39:41 I mean, it's [laughter] fine.

39:42 It's fine, but people can't afford it.

39:43 And just either buying like a bulk pack, right?

39:47 So, going inside and getting some[ __] is what

39:49 we call it when people go to the gas station.

39:51 So, men love to do that.

39:53 Most things are honestly crossgender.

39:55 Um, but men are much more susceptible

39:59 on our show to stopping in the gas station.

40:01 Definitely gooning

40:02 meme coins.

40:04 That's also just kind of more rare than you'd think.

40:08 Like yes, we get it, but even when we get it, it's so small.

40:12 So small.

40:13 Do you see a lot of Poly Market?

40:15 No, we really don't.

40:17 Surprising.

40:18 Gooning and energy drinks.

40:20 Yes, that is like every guy or of energy drinks and AI girlfriends.

40:24 Is AI girlfriends common?

40:25 No, no, no, not at all.

40:26 That was the first thing that's ever happened.

40:28 Like we'll get 20% who do like poly market and stuff, but even when they do it,

40:32 I mean it's bad for them even if they're not addicted

40:34 to it because they have bad debt if they're on the show, right?

40:36 But even still, that's a it is still small.

40:39 But I know it disproportionately impacts men as a whole.

40:42 Like that's for sure as a gendered percentage,

40:46 but as a percentage of people on my show or overall society, it's still lower.

40:51 But it's again definitely more men.

40:53 Are you seeing them spend money on women in general?

40:58 other than watching him naked.

41:00 You mean in person women?

41:01 That's hard for Jenzie.

41:02 [clears throat] [laughter] I struggle with that.

41:04 Um uh but yeah, I mean you'll see people go on Yeah,

41:09 you'll see a date here and there, but it's not it's not crazy.

41:12 Not a lot of big gift buying, not a lot of going out to dates.

41:17 Even in relationships, you'll see them spend just as much as a couple

41:21 as a single person does on getting McDonald's for themselves every day.

41:24 Hm.

41:25 It's pretty It's pretty crazy.

41:27 Interesting.

41:27 And then just to close the loop on the O of, would you say

41:32 that's like a reason they're going broke or would you say it's like not?

41:37 It all stacks up, but it's one of those reoccurrings, right?

41:40 Where it's like the vast majority of men are doing it right now.

41:44 And it's I know $10 won't make a break,

41:48 but if you do $10 a few times a month and then you go out

41:50 to eat every other day and stop for an energy drink every day to work,

41:53 all this stuff really starts to stack up.

41:55 Especially if you're starting to put it

41:56 on a credit card where you're only making minimum monthly

41:59 payments or not putting as much on it as you spent on it in the previous month.

42:03 It just really starts to stack and then it just you hit

42:05 that breaking point where all of a sudden you cannot afford it anymore.

42:09 How about courses?

42:11 No, that's uh again that kind of falls in that smaller pool, but when they do,

42:17 they go hard, which really sucks because they

42:20 it's fair that courses have a bad reputation.

42:22 Like we do courses, we have educational programs and but they're good.

42:26 Same with Ramsay's is good.

42:28 I know like you you're friends with Graham

42:30 Graham as well and he has a good program.

42:32 There's there's good programs out there.

42:33 Yet the programs I see these people do, it's like a $10,000 day trading program.

42:38 I'm not like what are you doing?

42:40 Like these people are[ __] morons.

42:41 Why aren't they buying the $200, you know,

42:44 learn how to budget and invest properly program that like we do?

42:50 Get rich with day trading.

42:51 Yeah.

42:51 It's the get-rich quick.

42:52 That's what people want to do.

42:53 So when we do s see it,

42:55 they go crazy and they usually finance like a 10,000 hour program really

42:59 which is life destroying.

43:01 It's so stupid.

43:03 Makes no sense.

43:03 And then it encourages them to do day trading.

43:05 And I don't know.

43:06 Do you do you day trade?

43:07 Are you day trader?

43:08 No.

43:08 Did you see the new rules that went out last week?

43:10 No.

43:11 What happened?

43:11 You used to have to have $25,000 in your account

43:14 to do more than three day trades a week.

43:17 I think it was three.

43:18 They got rid of that rule.

43:20 Now you can have any amount of money.

43:21 You could have $5 in there and you can do

43:23 as many day trades as you want throughout the week.

43:25 Sounds like our audience is going to be really rich.

43:27 Yes.

43:28 And really [laughter] quick.

43:30 It's ridiculous.

43:30 Um, yeah.

43:32 I was kind of thinking about the stuff men uh was spending money on in general,

43:38 like between energy drinks, o meme coins.

43:42 It's those reoccurrings, man.

43:43 That's where the the guys[ __] it up.

43:45 Where it's just like, yes, I've subscribed to a couple before and it's always,

43:49 you know, you click in and you cancel immediately so it doesn't re reoccur.

43:53 But it's these guys, they have multiple reoccurrings and they're like

43:56 chatting with them and they're paying to chat

43:57 and it's just some Indian dude like order you look really cute today guy.

44:01 Don't cancel me.

44:02 But like it's just some dude that's like you know[ __] just

44:09 chatting with you telling you you look hot and you're paying for it.

44:14 It's interesting.

44:14 I I'm curious from your view.

44:16 Do you think a lot of the reason men go broke is because they're simps?

44:20 Oh yeah, dude.

44:21 Gen Z men are losers.

44:23 __] losers.

44:24 The gender divide, the gender war right now, dating rates are record low,

44:28 marriage rates are record low, virginity rates are record high.

44:32 It's insane.

44:32 They're losers.

44:33 And honestly, both genders have responsibility to play.

44:36 Cancel culture went absolutely insane.

44:39 Like there was a correction that needed to be made and then it overcorrected.

44:42 And like guys will send one embarrassing

44:44 text and they'll get blasted all over online.

44:47 Or you'll go up to a woman and her like morbidly obese friend will say,

44:50 "He's not interested." And it's just like all

44:52 these embarrassing moments that are impossible to deal with.

44:55 And then guys are also just sitting inside[ __] gooning

44:58 to extremists online or like um or just watching porn,

45:02 not manning up to go cold approach and having horrible conversations.

45:07 And it's [clears throat] it's brutal.

45:09 And then dating apps came into picture and it's it is true.

45:11 Okaycid did their own analysis.

45:14 It is true that the top 80% of women only go for the top 20% of guys.

45:19 Um, and women have their own issues on the dating apps.

45:22 They're getting flooded, flooded, flooded.

45:23 I would not want to deal with that.

45:24 But then men are getting almost no matches, no engagement,

45:27 and it's we have so many things that are stacking against them right now.

45:31 And they are[ __] losers right now.

45:33 A lot of them, they're virgins.

45:34 It's not hard to[ __] It is not hard to[ __] I have never been a 10 out of 10.

45:38 Never been a seven out of 10.

45:39 I think I've been a solid I've been to a seven.

45:42 I think I think I've gone down to a five out of 10.

45:44 It is not hard to have sex before any notoriety or money.

45:48 It is not hard, but there's a lot of social pressure.

45:53 They're locked inside.

45:54 They're in weird communities and there's a big gender war going on right now,

45:59 even politically, right?

46:00 And um it's it's it's it's brutal and just I think people

46:06 hear the dating app statistic too that it's like bottom what is it?

46:11 Uh top 10% of guys get the bottom or get the 90% of women, whatever.

46:15 But I just my view on this and this might not be statistically accurate.

46:20 I just don't really think women seriously use dating apps.

46:23 Probably not.

46:23 Who would?

46:24 Like I think they just kind of go outside and talk to guys, you know,

46:28 and guys assume that like oh dating apps

46:30 are like where people are supposed to meet

46:32 and it's just and it's just kind of cope from them actually going outside and

46:36 it's like a video game swiping, right?

46:37 And yeah, men are staying inside.

46:39 They're not going out.

46:40 Drinking has dramatically fallen among Jenzi.

46:43 That's overall good health.

46:44 But it's actually it is like pretty much like every

46:47 like men's advocate and not like a weird extremist way

46:51 because you know there's like the crazy[ __] I don't

46:53 know[ __] But just like in terms of like just getting

46:55 out there and just like being a normal person like

46:58 a part of that drinking statistics is actually kind of bad

47:01 cuz you need that social lubricant to kind of go

47:03 out there and cold approach and get a little more social.

47:06 I'm not saying get plastered and[ __] up your liver all this stuff

47:09 or blow all your money on drinking but you need to go out.

47:12 You need a cold approach.

47:13 You know, my ex before my current girlfriend was a cold approach.

47:17 It works.

47:17 She didn't know who I was.

47:19 She only learned afterwards.

47:20 And um you have to be able to do it.

47:23 But guys are not willing to do it right now.

47:25 And some of it is fair.

47:26 You get plastered online.

47:27 You get put in the tea app or in weird Facebook groups.

47:30 You know, it's like there are real things that have led to the fear,

47:33 but there's probably too much fear, overblown fear.

47:36 Now they're losers paying for Only Fans.

47:38 And it kind of sucks cuz it's also just not hard to have sex.

47:41 Go out to the bar, have sex.

47:44 Pretty easy.

47:45 Everyone's trying to[ __] It's crazy how that happens.

47:49 How that works.

47:50 Do you think having a girlfriend makes you spend more money or less money?

47:57 Mine hasn't changed that much.

47:58 I mean, I've gotten a couple like nice gifts for like Christmas and birthday.

48:03 I mean, I've spent more money on myself because I've been forced to.

48:07 This isn't even like anything special, but um no,

48:12 my I mean just my cost per going out to eat,

48:15 but she's making me eat at home anyway more to lose weight.

48:17 So, it's like no, I think my spending's gone up.

48:19 I'm sure for most people, yes, it is.

48:21 It is up though.

48:22 M the one thing I am a little out of touch

48:24 on is like I've never like been I I there was like

48:28 a six-month phase in LA where I would just[ __] get like

48:31 ramen noodles and[ __] and just save money and cook for myself.

48:35 But just do you recommend that everyone should be

48:37 cooking for themselves if they're making 50k a year?

48:40 Yeah.

48:40 Well, okay.

48:42 Well, caveats depends your financial situation.

48:44 If there's no emergency fund, if there's high APR debt, then yes, absolutely.

48:51 Meal prep, meal prep, meal prep.

48:54 Cheap, $300 a month per person budget.

48:56 LA, that's a little harder,

48:57 but in most places you can do that and we prove it with our local grocery store,

49:00 HB like once a quarter.

49:01 We do the math.

49:02 Uh, it'll probably have to go up to 350 soon.

49:04 We'll see.

49:05 But even still, yes, most people should be doing that.

49:08 But if you're making 50 and you have a fully funded

49:12 six-month emergency fund and you don't have any high interest debt,

49:15 that's where you go to the 50 3020 rule, which is 50% on needs,

49:19 30% on fun, which can be going out to eat, and 20% on saving.

49:24 If you're hitting that 20% on saving, then I do not care.

49:27 As long as you're living a halfway decent life,

49:29 you're not overspending on your necessities or underpending.

49:32 We don't want you to[ __] you know, live in like a cave as well.

49:35 Um, you're living an actually decent life.

49:37 We want people to go out to eat.

49:39 50,000 LA harder.

49:41 Your bills stretch a lot a lot thinner there.

49:45 But yeah.

49:47 Yeah.

49:47 Absolutely.

49:48 We want people to go out to eat.

49:49 It just it really depends on where they are in life.

49:52 What's the most money you've seen a guy spend on women?

49:55 Yeah.

49:55 I have had people I had someone throw I think it was like $25,000 for Dari.

50:03 I'm I'm not in that world.

50:04 It was like my first time actually kind of hearing about it.

50:06 Everyone around me knew what it was, but I didn't know it.

50:08 But it was like her African village parents so that she

50:11 could bring he could bring her overseas and marry her.

50:14 He had to like pay like a down payment almost.

50:18 Um uh we've had a few 90-day fiance type relationships on the show.

50:22 They've had to spend a lot of money.

50:23 So we've had tens of thousands of dollars go to that for sure.

50:27 So what are they purchasing?

50:31 Well, the visa process is a little expensive.

50:33 the lawyers um flights back and forth to see each other throughout that process.

50:39 How did they meet?

50:39 Just Instagram or something?

50:41 Oh, weird apps.

50:41 You know, the 90-day fiance type apps, right?

50:45 Yeah.

50:46 Huh.

50:45 So, we've had two people from Africa and then we had one guy,

50:49 she wasn't there, but one, she was from Southeast Asia somewhere as well,

50:54 and he spent a lot of money on that.

50:56 And then the guy I remember you talking about it was years

50:59 ago now so I'm a little fuzzy on the details but yeah he

51:01 was spending a[ __] ton of money on like oh we I mean

51:04 we've had guys spend a[ __] ton of money on strippers and stuff.

51:07 Uh so that's kind of I don't think

51:09 that qualifies the same as your question though when it

51:11 comes to spending on girlfriends but yeah people blow

51:16 tens of thousands to get their get their love.

51:19 I think when when usually once people on the show already

51:22 have the love of their life or they're already dating someone,

51:25 they're not going like tens of thousands into it though.

51:27 But a lot of people have spent tens of thousands to acquire that on the show.

51:31 Do you think a good relationship generally saves

51:33 men from a lot of poor spending habits?

51:36 It definitely can because if you're the[ __] if

51:39 you the guy are a[ __] and maybe she's smart, she budgets, it definitely can.

51:42 But I I've seen it where like the guy was doing well

51:45 financially and then she came in and she was like a crazy spender,

51:48 didn't care about debt or budgeting and she tanked it.

51:51 So it it can go both ways.

51:52 Obviously it depends on who has what knowledge base or discipline going into it.

51:57 Before I ask about this, who do you think

51:58 has been the most financially responsible guest on your show?

52:03 Amth if that counts.

52:06 Really?

52:05 Oh yeah.

52:05 She owns gas stations and I think she was worth

52:08 like 25 million at the time of filming two years ago.

52:11 So absolutely what's interesting is no actually she did spend

52:16 a lot of money um to probably not but even

52:22 still he technically I think in the end once we

52:26 discovered more things at the end even though he's being

52:28 really dumb with his money he probably had a higher

52:31 net worth just because he's accidentally put things into assets

52:35 like cars and stuff and luckily for him hasn't really

52:39 gone into debt he just throws away pay his money,

52:41 but he doesn't like go into debt.

52:43 So, he has some assets that he could liquidate if necessary,

52:46 like his house and some crazy cars.

52:49 So, technically not financially responsible,

52:51 but he has a higher net worth than most people on the show.

52:54 Yeah, I think Togei said something like, uh,

52:57 you can't lose if you don't quit when it comes to gambling.

53:00 What do you think of that advice?

53:02 __] I mean, that's what that doesn't make sense.

53:05 That doesn't make sense.

53:06 I don't understand.

53:08 Just joking.

53:09 But um I wanted to ask you about looks maxing.

53:12 There's Oh, sure.

53:13 a growing trend online where young men spend

53:15 heavily on their appearance to become more attractive.

53:18 Do you think looks maxing is a good financial investment?

53:21 [laughter] Uh I guess it could be uh to I think statistically, right?

53:28 I don't have this data at my fingertip, but good-looking people tend to get,

53:33 you know, in terms of in-person job interviews, higher success rates.

53:37 uh obviously helps you in the dating pool, might help you get a partner.

53:41 Um interview processes.

53:43 I mean, it helps people throughout life being more attractive.

53:47 Uh has the looks maxing stuff

53:48 statistically proven to actually increase people's attractiveness?

53:52 I haven't not a looks max expert personally.

53:55 There's something about every inch of height you have,

53:57 you make another like $10,000 a year or something, but I don't know if

54:01 And it helps on the dating apps as well.

54:03 like a worthy investment for money.

54:05 Maybe a little, but I think it's probably a decent

54:08 investment for actually successful in dating because dating is very superficial.

54:12 It's even more superficial right now.

54:14 And people people's expectations are insane.

54:17 You'll have the ugliest[ __] in the world having

54:19 the expectation that they can only get tens out of tens.

54:21 It's kind of crazy.

54:22 Like I I don't know where people have valued themselves is all the way up here.

54:26 I try to be reasonable with my value.

54:29 Um I don't know.

54:30 So it could be good.

54:32 But does look maxing actually work?

54:33 Does it actually work in terms of like getting people more attractive?

54:36 Because that's my question because you can't and get higher.

54:40 There's two parts of looks maxing basically.

54:42 Like there there's soft maxing and hard maxing.

54:45 So one is plastic surgery and then one is doing stuff like working out

54:50 and I don't know like doing your hair better, that kind of stuff.

54:54 Well, I mean self-confidence in general,

54:56 you do better when you're more self-confident.

54:59 You do better at your job.

55:00 If you're working out, you're likely to do better in most things because one,

55:03 you're disciplined enough to work out,

55:04 so you're disciplined enough to budget and a lot

55:05 of other things and diet and whatnot.

55:07 If you're working out, you will have more energy and be will

55:11 be able to produce higher results across the board.

55:13 You'll be able to work longer and harder than other people.

55:16 Um, so working out, working out leads to less depression,

55:20 less mental health issues, which leads to better results in life.

55:23 So I think working out in general, looks maxing or not,

55:25 is going to lead to a positive return on investment.

55:28 Clav says that you should take out your student loans

55:31 and spend the money on plastic surgery instead of school because

55:34 don't think they allow that.

55:36 He says you won't get in trouble and you'll mog.

55:39 You might get in trouble and you will mog, but while in trouble.

55:44 Do you think that's a better investment than college?

55:46 Random question really quick.

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55:51 cuz if you're like me,

55:53 you probably didn't know that over 70% of men's grooming products

55:56 have chemicals that can disrupt

55:58 your endocrine system or your testosterone levels.

56:01 Now, I care a lot about my health,

56:03 but I didn't really think any healthy products could make my hair look good.

56:08 So, that's why I was so glad I met the guys at Based.

56:11 They gave me their shower duo shampoo conditioner,

56:13 and it's made with plant-based ingredients like peppermint or argan oil.

56:18 So, there's no sulfates, no hormone disruptors,

56:21 nothing that's going to mess with your body.

56:23 And after using it for a while now, genuinely, my hair does feel way healthier,

56:27 like clean and hydrated as opposed to dry and dull.

56:33 And honestly, I think it looks better, too.

56:35 So, if you've been using the same products

56:37 forever without thinking twice about what's actually in them,

56:40 make sure to check out Base Body Works.

56:43 It's a plant-based all-natural men's grooming brand that actually performs.

56:47 So, if you want to try it out for yourself,

56:49 just use code jackneal at bassbodyworks.com for 20% off your first order.

56:54 Plus, you'll get a free toiletry bag when you buy your first set.

56:57 So, again, that is bassbodyworks.com code Jack Neil.

57:02 But anyway, guys, back to the podcast.

57:04 Do you think that's a better investment than college?

57:07 Well, seeing how I don't think you're allowed to.

57:09 I will need to fact check that, but I

57:10 really don't think you're allowed to do that.

57:12 He's talked about it a lot.

57:13 I think it's a thing.

57:14 Okay.

57:14 Is he a valid source of student loan borrowing?

57:18 He went to uh Boston College.

57:20 He went to pretty good school.

57:21 Pretty smart kid.

57:22 Does that mean he's good at knowing

57:25 the laws and legals around student loan borrowing?

57:27 I don't know.

57:29 He's talking about it.

57:31 Good.

57:31 Let's assume it's true.

57:32 Do you think it's a good investment

57:33 instead of doing it towards school?

57:35 So, college or double jaw surgery?

57:41 College.

57:40 art degree or double jaw surgery.

57:44 Flip a coin.

57:46 [laughter] And yeah, equal return on investment there.

57:51 Do you think student loans should be illegal?

57:53 Illegal?

57:54 No.

57:54 It's like the concept.

57:55 No, but we definitely[ __] it up.

57:57 Like again, like many social programs,

58:00 I think it came with good intent where it's like,

58:03 oh, college is a little expensive.

58:04 We want people more people to be able to go to college.

58:06 Disadvantage people to go to college.

58:08 Sure.

58:08 But you can view it pretty much per year.

58:10 Every time you increase what people are allowed to borrow,

58:13 schools increase just as much if not maybe a little less.

58:17 Um what they will charge for it because why

58:20 would they not charge the max that people can borrow.

58:23 It helps invest in administrators building out

58:26 better uh facilities to attract more foreign students

58:30 which pay in cash and at higher rates which is even better for the school.

58:34 So, um, I mean, the the cost of college immediately just went to the moon

58:38 the moment the we allowed people to borrow as much as they wanted.

58:42 So, it it's it's it's pretty clear.

58:45 It's all in the data.

58:46 It's not surprising to anyone.

58:48 So, in order to reverse that, it would be brutal.

58:50 Colleges would close.

58:52 People wouldn't be able to go to college now for a while

58:54 if we just completely stopped the federal student loan system.

58:57 But, so, I don't think we could rip the band-aid off like that.

59:00 But, we also can't continue on this trend.

59:02 We can't because it's the federal government.

59:05 They'll garnish your wages.

59:06 This isn't like a personal loan that can

59:09 go to collections and fall off after seven years.

59:11 You're not getting out of these student loans.

59:14 So, it's really bad.

59:16 I don't know if they should be illegal.

59:17 Do you think they should be forgiven student loans?

59:20 Not without changing the system.

59:21 I'm not inherently opposed to like, "Oops, we[ __] up.

59:24 Let's reset." But if you do not actually

59:27 fix what got us here in the first place,

59:30 which is the infinite borrowing for any degree at any institution,

59:33 and they can raise the prices as much

59:35 as they want for administrators and football programs or whatever,

59:38 cuz only like 10 or 20 or 30 football

59:41 or sports programs actually make a return on their own investment.

59:44 The rest of them are[ __] You know, I went to Western Michigan University like,

59:47 "Woo, we got the national championship in hockey last year.

59:49 That's good.

59:50 But we still probably spent more than we made." Like, yay, I we get to win that.

59:55 I'm happy.

59:56 But is it does it actually make sense

59:57 for that school to have all those D1 programs?

1:00:00 No.

1:00:01 But that's okay.

1:00:02 Focus on the education.

1:00:03 Focus on the education.

1:00:05 Um[ __] What was your question?

1:00:07 If they should be forgiven.

1:00:08 Oh, not without changing the system.

1:00:11 Imagine you were to break this down for me

1:00:12 like exactly why like why are student loans predatory?

1:00:17 What is the key cause of them?

1:00:19 like I don't know if they're necessarily predatory.

1:00:23 I mean, some private ones might be, but federal not predatory.

1:00:27 No, I think I think it's more

1:00:29 the lack of education from parents and student counselors.

1:00:31 Again, the the mission over the past few decades,

1:00:34 which has not been an unfair mission, is to send people to college no matter

1:00:37 what cuz statistically it has improved the lives.

1:00:40 So, why did they raise the borrowing amount?

1:00:42 Well, they will always raise the borrowing amount because one,

1:00:45 inflation and cost of college goes up,

1:00:47 but cost of college goes up with the borrowing amount.

1:00:49 And it's also just it's a moral question of making sure everyone has access,

1:00:53 no matter where you come from, whatnot.

1:00:56 Um, but again, I think we've we've really messed it up

1:01:01 in terms of we've allowed every college in the world to have

1:01:03 a music program where I'm [clears throat] sorry if you're going

1:01:07 to um I can't think think of a think of a random town.

1:01:13 Where are you from?

1:01:15 Artstown, Kentucky.

1:01:16 Artstown.

1:01:17 Think if you're going to town college for trombone performance,

1:01:20 are you going to be the one who makes it versus the one who goes to Jiuliard?

1:01:23 Probably not.

1:01:23 Does that college need to have that?

1:01:25 Should we be encouraging someone to borrow $100,000 a year

1:01:28 to go do that just because it's their passion?

1:01:30 No.

1:01:31 So, we need to have a different conversation about what people

1:01:33 are doing when they head to college and borrow that money, right?

1:01:36 Really do.

1:01:37 I wish I wish every kid that is or[ __] I mean,

1:01:41 well, yeah, some of them are kids when they're getting their student loans,

1:01:44 but every 17, 18 year old before they were finishing,

1:01:49 they have to be the one to click.

1:01:50 And I wish on that site it was like, okay, you will be paying this much.

1:01:54 This will be your expected minimum monthly payment if

1:01:56 you do this trajectory from this institution after college.

1:01:59 Oh, and by the way, the major you picked your most likely first year out

1:02:03 of college pay is going to be this and you're borrowing this much for it.

1:02:06 We should just lay that out, educate them as much as possible because

1:02:09 right now the only education they'll get is

1:02:11 their student counselor and their parents and parents

1:02:14 don't know what the[ __] they're doing.

1:02:17 They don't.

1:02:17 But I don't blame them for it either.

1:02:19 I blame more the student counselors.

1:02:21 Yeah.

1:02:21 Student counselors are just responsible for getting the most amount of kids in.

1:02:24 They're not responsible for like what happens to you after.

1:02:28 Yeah.

1:02:27 So, the incentives are kind of messed up.

1:02:29 Um, actually on that, I would just say as a final note,

1:02:32 my student counselor in high school, I think I saw her four times.

1:02:36 She's the one that like guides you throughout.

1:02:38 One time was like, "Oh, what classes do you want to take next year?"

1:02:41 The other three times were making sure I'd go to college.

1:02:44 So, what like it was like she was

1:02:45 supposed to be helping me my entire time there.

1:02:47 No, it was just conversations about college.

1:02:49 That's the whole thing.

1:02:50 Let's bro.

1:02:52 I have a segment I think you'll find fun.

1:02:54 We'll call it smart or crash out where I give you a purchase

1:02:58 and you tell me whether or not it's a good purchase or a bad purchase.

1:03:01 And let's just assume the person makes 50k a year.

1:03:05 Um 50k a year where?

1:03:09 Let's qualify it further.

1:03:11 Texas.

1:03:12 Okay.

1:03:13 Okay.

1:03:13 Where's their uh debt in retirement situation and fully funded emergency fund?

1:03:20 Zero.

1:03:19 Zero on all.

1:03:20 Yeah, let's do zero.

1:03:21 No, no debt.

1:03:22 No debt, but no emergency fund.

1:03:24 No emergency fund.

1:03:25 Okay, cool.

1:03:25 Let's do it.

1:03:27 Yeah.

1:03:27 Um maybe like $1,000 in the bank.

1:03:30 Okay.

1:03:30 Yeah.

1:03:30 A Costco membership.

1:03:32 Yeah, that's fine.

1:03:33 If you're actually using and doing most

1:03:34 of your grocery shopping there, that's fine.

1:03:37 An MBA masters in business.

1:03:39 Yeah.

1:03:39 Yeah.

1:03:40 Great.

1:03:40 Absolutely.

1:03:42 Depends how much it cost to get and what how much you borrowed for it, but yeah.

1:03:45 Lasic eye surgery.

1:03:47 Yeah, that's good.

1:03:47 I mean, um, is it all cash or do they have decent eye insurance?

1:03:52 Like, depends how much is covered.

1:03:54 But hey, if you can do it, I'm okay with it.

1:03:55 I'd get the six-month emergency fund before doing that, but I'm not going

1:03:58 to freak out about it afterwards if you put it into your wants category.

1:04:03 Bitcoin, you can include it in a reasonably balanced portfolio.

1:04:06 Wouldn't do even half or even a quarter of my portfolio in it.

1:04:10 Personally, I have a very small percentage in crypto,

1:04:12 but yeah, I mean, Ethereum, Bitcoin has a small percentage.

1:04:16 Yeah, sure.

1:04:18 A pelaton.

1:04:19 Yeah, personal health is good.

1:04:21 Um, again, without an emergency fund, I would rather you go to the gym.

1:04:24 And I put gym and health and wellness

1:04:26 into everyone's budget no matter where they are.

1:04:28 So, that's good.

1:04:29 But maybe after your fully funed emergency fund is that if that's going

1:04:32 to keep you active even more than having a gym membership or going on walks,

1:04:36 then yeah, all about it.

1:04:38 An Equinox gym membership.

1:04:40 Sure, I'm good with it.

1:04:42 Really?

1:04:42 How much is it?

1:04:43 I think they're like 300 a month.

1:04:44 It's brutal.

1:04:45 if you're actually using it.

1:04:46 If you're actually using it, I'm okay.

1:04:47 Again, I would I would advocate, hey,

1:04:50 maybe let's start with like LA Fitness, see if you like it.

1:04:55 If you want the more dedicated classes and stuff with like Equinox,

1:04:57 Equinox, cool, do it.

1:05:00 But I'm okay with it.

1:05:01 Again, preferably get the emergency fund first.

1:05:04 Health and fitness is everything, though.

1:05:05 If you're not, you know,

1:05:07 I'm saying this, but if you're not going to live for a while,

1:05:12 what is the point of the sacrifice that is required

1:05:14 to do get all your finances in a good place anyway?

1:05:18 What's the point if you're not going to be around to do it?

1:05:21 So, take care of health and fitness.

1:05:24 Botox.

1:05:26 No, not yet.

1:05:27 Fully fun emergency fund, then take care of the wrinkles.

1:05:30 A boat?

1:05:32 __] no.

1:05:33 Absolutely not.

1:05:34 In that situation, no.

1:05:35 become become a millionaire first, please.

1:05:37 Boats are horrible investments.

1:05:39 It's not an investment.

1:05:40 It needs to be a toy.

1:05:42 A pool in your backyard.

1:05:44 Definitely.

1:05:44 Probably.

1:05:44 Also not.

1:05:45 Definitely a toy later.

1:05:47 If you know, if you're getting a pool before a fully funed emergency fund,

1:05:51 I'm burning your house down.

1:05:53 This This thing's [laughter][ __] stupid.

1:05:56 A designer dog from a breeder.

1:05:58 No.

1:05:59 Adopt anyway.

1:06:01 Regardless, just adopt.

1:06:03 A trip to Disney?

1:06:04 No, no.

1:06:06 I mean, what what even you're gonna spend thousands on there.

1:06:09 You're probably morbidly obese because you go into Disney anyway.

1:06:12 And so, you should probably go to Equinox.

1:06:15 Equinox, not Disney.

1:06:17 A 20K engagement ring financed at 24% APR.

1:06:21 Oh, if they're making 50, no.

1:06:22 Well, first of all, that the the interest rate,[ __] no.

1:06:25 Um, but if they're making 50,000, no.

1:06:27 As well, a wedding over $30,000.

1:06:31 Okay.

1:06:31 Are you paying all 30 or the parents chipping in?

1:06:35 yourself.

1:06:36 __] And is this U50?

1:06:37 She's not working.

1:06:38 Damn.

1:06:39 Brutal modern marriage.

1:06:41 Um, okay.

1:06:44 I wouldn't I wouldn't I'm almost more okay.

1:06:48 __] No, cuz they're going to finance it.

1:06:50 No.

1:06:50 No.

1:06:51 Try to cap it at 15 even.

1:06:52 It's still kind of brutal, but yeah.

1:06:54 A brand new Tesla on a 72-month loan.

1:06:57 What Tesla?

1:06:58 Newest model.

1:07:00 Model Y.

1:07:01 Model Y.

1:07:04 Okay.

1:07:04 base model.

1:07:08 Yeah.

1:07:07 What interest rate is 72?

1:07:11 What's the most common?

1:07:12 I think you can get them for like one

1:07:14 as low as one, right?

1:07:15 At like special promos.

1:07:16 If you're doing that, I'm not thrilled about the 72,

1:07:18 but I'm I would be I would accept a Ford F-150.

1:07:23 Definitely not cuz you're spending a[ __] ton of money.

1:07:25 The gas is going to be brutal for you at 50,

1:07:27 especially if we keep[ __] with the trader moves.

1:07:30 Um, [laughter] this is not not very good cuz you're

1:07:35 also probably not getting a great interest rate with it either.

1:07:38 It depends on the overall uh what kind of loan

1:07:40 and what I can get with it, but probably not.

1:07:43 Those are expensive.

1:07:44 A motorcycle?

1:07:46 No, cuz that is that going to be your daily driver?

1:07:48 Do you live in San Diego?

1:07:49 If not, no.

1:07:51 A used Toyota Camry and cash?

1:07:53 Sure.

1:07:53 Yeah, [snorts] sure.

1:07:54 That's fine.

1:07:55 [laughter]

1:07:57 Perfect.

1:07:57 Can you tell someone's bad with money simply by looking at them?

1:08:01 The nice clothes and nice car thing is actually kind of indict indicative.

1:08:05 I really feel like it is.

1:08:07 When I see someone that looks like all like blinged out or designer or nice car,

1:08:14 especially if it's like a stereotypical type of car.

1:08:19 Um, I assume the finances are pretty bad.

1:08:21 That's a That's a pretty easy tell.

1:08:23 Is there any like physical signs that someone's bad with money?

1:08:27 Like do you think girls with septums are bad with money?

1:08:31 Okay, I see where you're going.

1:08:32 Uh, I mean, maybe.

1:08:34 I don't know.

1:08:35 They might be more annoying.

1:08:36 I don't know about bad with money.

1:08:38 That's hard to tell.

1:08:40 I feel like seems like every woman I uh meet these days have sess piercing.

1:08:44 Um, which I know it's fun to make fun of, but actually,

1:08:47 you know, I find a edgy girl pretty attractive, so doesn't actually bother me.

1:08:51 But man, I don't know.

1:08:54 I don't know cuz even like the biggest slob ever

1:08:57 could be is like a doing digital security making $250,000.

1:09:02 Like it that's really hard today.

1:09:05 Really is.

1:09:06 I don't know.

1:09:08 Even like racial stereotypes or something if you want to get into that.

1:09:11 Like even that's harder to tell.

1:09:12 It's like it's like no maybe where someone lives

1:09:18 but you don't know where someone's

1:09:19 living unless you're like following them home.

1:09:22 Are you following them home?

1:09:24 [laughter]

1:09:25 Is there any like uh one thing that like stands out to you that you're

1:09:28 like oh another one with a septum like another one like anything like that?

1:09:32 No.

1:09:33 Well, I mean, sure, sometimes if they're like, "Roo, rent control,

1:09:38 like one of the most clear failed policies in the history of all

1:09:42 of humanity that has never worked in one city it's been put in.

1:09:46 Just permitting gets cut in half the next day and rent goes up for everyone

1:09:49 except for the few selected few that get the positive results of it." I mean,

1:09:54 yeah, usually like, you know, get a little piercing there.

1:09:56 They're like, "Woo, rent control is great." And I'm like,

1:09:58 just cuz it sounds good and feels

1:10:01 moral doesn't mean it's ever worked in practice.

1:10:03 So yeah, usually they're kind of like things like that.

1:10:06 What can you tell about a person's childhood by their spinning habits?

1:10:15 Um, we've definitely had a lot of people on the show that are Yeah.

1:10:21 One thing that really lines up is the going out to eat and also health style.

1:10:27 Um, so people that have like really unhealthy parents that go

1:10:33 out to eat a lot or have really bad food,

1:10:35 they also tend to be the more large people on the show.

1:10:40 Um, fat people that just spend so much money going to McDonald's and they're

1:10:46 the same thing was happening with their parents

1:10:48 that they're just used to that lifestyle.

1:10:51 It's an easier lifestyle.

1:10:52 Well, it is an endlessly dopamine fueling lifestyle,

1:10:55 getting that food and it is delicious for what it's worth.

1:11:00 Um, but that that that really that really does fall generational trends.

1:11:06 It really does.

1:11:08 What's the most irresponsible purchase you've made in 2026?

1:11:12 Just the ring, probably.

1:11:14 Anything else?

1:11:15 We bought new furniture for the office.

1:11:16 You didn't see it yet.

1:11:17 It's not here, but we're making we're sprucing up the office.

1:11:20 We wrote a quarter million dollar check for that.

1:11:24 That's brutal.

1:11:24 That makes me want to put a gun in my mouth.

1:11:26 That's brutal.

1:11:27 But we're doing it nice.

1:11:28 It's good for recruitment.

1:11:29 It's good for people that are here.

1:11:30 So, there's like lounge space, co-working space, uh private spaces,

1:11:34 you know, call booths, all these different things.

1:11:37 Like, did we need to do that?

1:11:39 No.

1:11:39 The business is doing fine.

1:11:41 We've recruited pretty well.

1:11:43 But it is nice for the employees.

1:11:44 I want the if they have to be at work,

1:11:47 I want the place that they're at work to be halfway decent.

1:11:49 So, that was stupid.

1:11:52 Wasn't necessary, but maybe we'll see a return on investment with that and we

1:11:56 can take it wherever we go or liquidate it if we go out of business,

1:11:59 which, you know, hopefully not, but um like that was pretty bad.

1:12:05 I'm renovating my new house,

1:12:07 but it's also not a crazy how for my income situation.

1:12:10 Again, I've been very blessed.

1:12:11 It's dramatically under what I think most normal people would do,

1:12:15 but the renovation for the um for the purchase of the house,

1:12:19 it's it's a little more up there.

1:12:21 Do you like buying things?

1:12:24 I I love new tech.

1:12:26 I love new tech.

1:12:27 Like I have a maxed out MacBook Pro.

1:12:29 I don't I don't edit videos anymore.

1:12:31 I did when I first started this, but obviously

1:12:33 I that's not where my time is best spent now.

1:12:36 So that was stupid.

1:12:38 That was so unnecessary.

1:12:39 I could do everything I do on a MacBook Air.

1:12:42 No reason for that.

1:12:43 So, that was stupid to spend a few thousand bucks on that.

1:12:46 That was also last year.

1:12:47 Um, but I do I love to buy new tech like

1:12:50 the new Apple Watch or the new iPhone or the new whatever,

1:12:53 the new smart speaker.

1:12:54 It's like I don't always use it.

1:12:56 So, yes, I do like to buy that.

1:12:59 I do like to go out to eat.

1:13:00 I actually am doing it quite a lesson now.

1:13:03 And it's more just cuz I'm like, "Hey,

1:13:04 where do you want to go to eat?" and she's like, "Uh,

1:13:06 you're sitting right in that[ __] chair and we're

1:13:08 going to make some healthy fit." And I'm like,

1:13:09 "Okay." Um, so that's the less of my choice.

1:13:15 I don't know.

1:13:16 I don't know.

1:13:16 I did get I did get my Plaid Model X.

1:13:19 I did get my Plaid Model X before they discontinued the Model X.

1:13:22 So, I guess I got lucky on that.

1:13:24 I I don't remember if that was this year or the end of last year.

1:13:27 That was stupid because I already had a Model X a few years old,

1:13:30 but I wanted the updated chip and I was

1:13:32 I didn't get plaid last time and I'm like,

1:13:34 "Damn it." So, I got planned, but I traded in.

1:13:36 It was like half off.

1:13:37 So, um, that worked, but it was stupid.

1:13:39 I didn't need it, but it was also wasn't financially irresponsible for me.

1:13:43 What thing do you see people waste money

1:13:45 on that you personally don't judge them for?

1:13:50 Ooh.

1:13:50 That I don't judge them for.

1:13:51 Waste money on I judge everyone on everything.

1:13:56 I mean, I was judging you on your accent at the beginning.

1:13:58 [laughter] This is This is kind of what I do.

1:14:00 I'm a judging person.

1:14:01 Is there one that like other people might judge

1:14:04 them for and you're just like it's probably fine.

1:14:06 I I don't blame them.

1:14:09 __] man.

1:14:12 Um h that's that that's a difficult one for me.

1:14:15 Listen, uh maybe if it's like taking care of a sick relative,

1:14:18 but other people wouldn't judge them on that.

1:14:21 The gym thing, we already talked about the gym thing.

1:14:22 Maybe some people would judge, but I think health and fitness is,

1:14:25 you know, take care of that.

1:14:26 That's number one.

1:14:28 Um

1:14:28 how about giving like family money or something like Yeah,

1:14:30 but I'm against that usually,

1:14:32 unless again, it's like taking care of a sick relative and it's not enabling.

1:14:35 If it's enabling, I'm against it, right?

1:14:37 A gift.

1:14:37 I'm not against a gift,

1:14:38 but I'm against giving gifts for Christmas

1:14:40 if you're[ __] broke and have bad debt.

1:14:43 Um uh I I don't freak out if I guess like a one time OF purchase and like

1:14:54 I guess some people are like hardcore like

1:14:56 no no if you even watch porn you'll die.

1:14:58 So maybe something like that.

1:15:02 Um,

1:15:02 what if someone buys something and it's like their birthday?

1:15:05 Can they afford it or not?

1:15:07 If they can't afford it, if it's stupid for their financial position, no.

1:15:11 But it's their birthday.

1:15:12 I don't give a[ __] Everyone has a birthday.

1:15:14 Someone every everyone watching this video has a birthday this year.

1:15:18 It's not very unique.

1:15:19 I don't give a[ __] about a birthday.

1:15:20 __] your birthday.

1:15:21 Do you think people should work on their birthday?

1:15:23 Uh, they can if they want to, or they can take it off.

1:15:26 off.

1:15:26 And if they can't take it off, I don't have any sympathy.

1:15:29 Like, I don't care.

1:15:30 I worked on mine this year, but then I took off my girlfriend's birthday.

1:15:34 I don't know.

1:15:35 It doesn't matter.

1:15:35 If you can take it off and you want to do it,

1:15:37 but if you have to work on your birthday, I have zero sympathy.

1:15:40 I don't care.

1:15:41 What?

1:15:41 What?

1:15:41 This isn't sweet 16.

1:15:43 What are we doing?

1:15:45 You're an adult.

1:15:46 What do you think of birthday months?

1:15:48 That Yeah, that's the most That's the dumbest[ __] I've ever heard in my life.

1:15:51 Birthday months.

1:15:52 What a stupid trend.

1:15:54 What a stupid trend.

1:15:55 What are we doing?

1:15:56 Why do you get there's 12 a year and you're

1:15:58 going to allow yourself to[ __] up the other

1:16:00 11 by living to the max for a just one

1:16:04 of them because it's your birthday falls in that month?

1:16:07 You were born.

1:16:08 You're not unique.

1:16:09 Congratulations.

1:16:10 Every human being's been born.

1:16:13 Okay.

1:16:13 No one's going to give a[ __] when you're dead either.

1:16:16 Same with me.

1:16:16 Who gives a[ __] We don't need to celebrate.

1:16:19 Like we'll be sad for a second when we die.

1:16:22 Well, other people will.

1:16:23 We won't know cuz we're dead.

1:16:25 But okay, who gives a birthday month is so[ __] stupid.

1:16:29 I don't understand.

1:16:30 Why destroy the rest of your year for one month?

1:16:34 Have fun on your birthday.

1:16:35 Sure, if you can afford it.

1:16:36 Same with Christmas.

1:16:37 Same with anything.

1:16:38 If you have made bad mistakes or you

1:16:41 come from a place of disadvantage that still sucks,

1:16:43 but reality is reality is reality in the end.

1:16:46 And there's only one way out to get better

1:16:48 and that is sacrificing for the first time in your[ __] life.

1:16:51 So sometimes you just have to say no and be an adult and say no.

1:16:55 It's not bad to say no.

1:16:58 It's hard.

1:16:59 Have you seen people spend a lot of money on like funerals?

1:17:03 H no.

1:17:04 I think funeral came up once in our conversation,

1:17:06 but that's something I didn't knock either.

1:17:09 Sometimes it's a little out of their control.

1:17:10 You know, there's family dynamics at play.

1:17:12 You don't get to fully have say in it.

1:17:15 And I mean, like, I mean, the death of someone you love,

1:17:20 that's I mean, that's hard to[ __] with.

1:17:22 That's hard.

1:17:23 Uh, another one of those where it's like it's hard to say no to is tithing.

1:17:28 It's like it's so embedded into their entire moral fabric where if you're like,

1:17:32 "Okay, it's a little stupid for you to do this.

1:17:34 It doesn't make sense." When it's some when it's something that's it's not

1:17:37 ideology or political or even just it's a literal part of their identity.

1:17:44 They think they're going to die if they don't do it.

1:17:46 It's like it's not going to McDonald's.

1:17:48 It's hard to tell people no.

1:17:49 I tell them no, but it's hard for me to fight against that hardcore.

1:17:53 But I do try to make the logical reality.

1:17:55 It's like I want you to tithe if you want to tithe.

1:17:57 I want you to donate if you want to donate.

1:17:59 Uh if you want to tithe to a church or donate to NPR,

1:18:01 I don't give a[ __] You can do more of that.

1:18:04 If you sacrifice temporarily by not improving your life,

1:18:08 figuring out how to get a better job, having more savings,

1:18:10 and all this, you will contribute more more over

1:18:12 your entire lifetime than doing just little bits right now.

1:18:17 So, I I try, but it is hard to be like tell people

1:18:20 they can't when it's seriously embedded

1:18:22 in their identity and full world beliefs.

1:18:26 Do a lot of guests on your show use girl math to justify their spending?

1:18:31 They certainly try to.

1:18:32 I mean, I think every gender has their own stupid math.

1:18:35 Men with ripping Pokemon cards and buying upgrading their PC and[ __] like that.

1:18:39 Yeah, you can you can cope the[ __] out of that till you're dead.

1:18:43 And then, yeah, girls be like, "It's girl math.

1:18:45 They think they're cute." And I'm sure they get cheered on with their um Tik

1:18:49 Tok cheers them on cuz they got put

1:18:50 in their little ecosystem where it's just like,

1:18:52 "Woo woo, you can do no wrong." But no, of course it's like that's a cope.

1:18:57 Is it a real thing?

1:18:58 I can't tell if it's a joke or not.

1:19:00 I think it's it's half joke, half not, half cope.

1:19:04 It's just like I it's like a new version of I deserve

1:19:08 it or like thinking you're entitled or just like brushing it off,

1:19:11 putting your head in the sand, facing the consequences later.

1:19:14 It's a cope.

1:19:15 It's a cope and it's a silly way of coping.

1:19:19 Um, so maybe a little Tik Tok Instagram trend on it for sure,

1:19:24 but there's no actual girl math.

1:19:27 It doesn't make sense.

1:19:28 It's not a real thing.

1:19:29 It's a cope and they just want to do it and they want to have joy

1:19:33 of what they're getting right now instead of actually

1:19:36 just sacrificing for a second and saying no.

1:19:38 Do you think pets are keeping people broke?

1:19:42 It can.

1:19:42 It can.

1:19:43 And if you do pets wrong, it absolutely can.

1:19:45 If you don't There's a couple things.

1:19:47 You can get a dog and then something goes wrong with the dog and you don't have

1:19:50 pet insurance and you're[ __] And then you're not

1:19:52 going to you took the responsibility of the dog.

1:19:54 You don't want the dog to die.

1:19:55 You love the dog.

1:19:56 It puts you in a lot of debt and then you have to pay out the debt.

1:19:59 That's bad.

1:20:00 You can get a dog.

1:20:01 You can get shitty pet insurance.

1:20:02 Some cheap ass pet insurance because you're told to get pet insurance.

1:20:04 So, you just get whatever.

1:20:05 You don't look into it.

1:20:06 Oh, doesn't cover anything.

1:20:07 Then you're a lot of debt.

1:20:08 It's[ __] You can get a dog and you get $50 a month pet insurance.

1:20:11 Oo, that's a minimum payment.

1:20:12 That's hard.

1:20:12 At least it makes sure you don't go broke if something

1:20:15 would happen with the dog cuz it's actually good pet insurance,

1:20:16 but now it's a new minimum monthly payment.

1:20:18 You can't afford minimum monthly payments.

1:20:20 That's brutal.

1:20:20 Now you got to get a special dog

1:20:22 food cuz they're allergic to chicken or whatever.

1:20:24 It it can be for some people.

1:20:26 Yes, it it certainly can be.

1:20:27 What's the most amount of money you've seen someone spend on their dog?

1:20:30 Oh, tens of thousands.

1:20:31 I've personally spent tens of thousands.

1:20:33 My my my uh Great Pyrenees at home,

1:20:36 I've probably spent more than anyone I know on my dog.

1:20:39 She's a lot.

1:20:40 What are you buying?

1:20:41 She surgery cuz she won't stop eating things that'll kill her.

1:20:45 So, it's like we're she's monitored 24/7 at all times

1:20:48 and she has a muzzle when we can't see her.

1:20:50 Not cuz she's vicious or anything.

1:20:52 She's the sweetest little thing, but she wants to kill herself.

1:20:55 So, she's had multiple life-saving surgeries to get

1:20:57 something a blockage out of her intestine.

1:21:00 Um, what is she eating?

1:21:02 Anything.

1:21:02 One was some wrappers because she found some candy.

1:21:05 One was like a little thing that goes

1:21:07 under furniture that stops it from sliding.

1:21:09 That was her first one.

1:21:11 Um, she she's had three.

1:21:13 I don't remember what the other one is,

1:21:14 but the one where she had uh is it sepsis?

1:21:17 Septsus, whatever.

1:21:18 Where like, you know, everything sepsis.

1:21:21 Yeah.

1:21:21 Uh, it was really bad.

1:21:22 She almost died.

1:21:23 That was $30,000 I spent.

1:21:26 Jeez.

1:21:25 About pet insurance.

1:21:26 It helps.

1:21:27 It helps.

1:21:28 But you still got to pay for it up front then get reimbured later.

1:21:30 How about other people?

1:21:31 Have you seen this?

1:21:32 Still tens of thousands.

1:21:33 They'll put it on like a care credit card usually is what it's called.

1:21:36 Uh it's usually what people get with for the vets.

1:21:38 And it's usually it's a surgery like that.

1:21:41 It's a life-saving surgery.

1:21:42 Something really bad happened with the dog

1:21:44 or the dog goes through chemo or something.

1:21:46 Absolutely.

1:21:47 in term uh I did have a guy that was spending

1:21:50 thousands not tens of thousands but thousands on getting owning a percentage

1:21:55 of breeding dogs for French bulldogs owning a percentage of the nut

1:22:02 so that he got you know every time that dog

1:22:05 nut and they sold the puppy he got like 10%

1:22:08 of the profits from the puppy and yeah he made zero dollars

1:22:11 he he was losing money no[ __] but either way he

1:22:14 was spending tens of thousands trying to buy shares of dogs.

1:22:18 That sounds like it could be good.

1:22:20 Could be.

1:22:20 Wasn't.

1:22:21 [laughter] Obviously,

1:22:22 people make money breeding dogs or else people wouldn't do it.

1:22:25 I think he's just a[ __] I wonder how much money's in that.

1:22:29 Well, definitely a lot of money.

1:22:30 Puppy.

1:22:30 What's the most seen someone spend on a dog?

1:22:34 It's going to be a designer dog, like a French bulldog.

1:22:38 Thousands.

1:22:38 Thousands of dollars.

1:22:39 Yeah.

1:22:40 A few thousand.

1:22:41 What do you see people waste money on and convince themselves it's investing?

1:22:45 Oh, convince themselves it's investing trinkets.

1:22:48 __] Lab boooos.

1:22:51 Lab boooos.

1:22:52 They always they're like, "Oh, but I can resell it.

1:22:53 It's good." But now the fads and the trends, their rise and falls are so quick.

1:22:57 It's not Beanie Babies where it's like at the top

1:22:59 the top of the field and value and collecting them forever.

1:23:03 You know, in the '9s, 2000s, now these fats come and go so quick.

1:23:06 So, you're buying something on the way up,

1:23:07 it's already on the way down before it gets delivered.

1:23:09 So people really convince themselves with the trinkets and[ __] like

1:23:13 that that it's a good investment and it's it I mean it never is.

1:23:17 The little boo boos weren't a good investment.

1:23:19 The none of that[ __] I don't know.

1:23:21 Who knows what they're on with PopMart now, but they're on something.

1:23:25 They got some new fad going on.

1:23:26 I'm sure we'll see it on the show.

1:23:28 It always happens.

1:23:29 So they think that's a good investment.

1:23:31 I mean, people cope [clears throat] the[ __] out of uh vacations.

1:23:34 They're like, "Oh, I can make more

1:23:35 money because I'm happy." It's like, "Well, yeah,

1:23:36 but now you're in debt." It's just like people cope the[ __] out of everything.

1:23:40 Do you think that's true?

1:23:41 What?

1:23:42 No.

1:23:42 Not like just the concept of you have to spend money to make money.

1:23:45 Like spend money on your happiness to make more money.

1:23:47 No, not necessarily.

1:23:48 But again, if you can afford it,

1:23:49 it makes sense and maybe you are happy and it makes you work harder.

1:23:51 Sure.

1:23:52 But if you're just going further and further into 30% debt to do it.

1:23:55 No, you're not getting a 30% return on it.

1:23:58 You might get like a small 5% 2% return.

1:24:01 That might have longevity over the course of your life,

1:24:03 but not if you're going into 30% debt for it.

1:24:06 So now where are the investments?

1:24:09 Obviously overall stock market, maybe a little crypto,

1:24:12 some life insuranceances, car insuranceances,

1:24:15 home insuranceances, pet insuranceances.

1:24:17 So insuranceances, um potential real estate,

1:24:20 but even that it's like barely beats the market anyway.

1:24:23 And personal residences.

1:24:25 Um and then personal health, education, good education.

1:24:29 There's[ __] education, there's[ __] health, there's[ __] everything.

1:24:32 So,

1:24:34 what's the richest guest you've had on that uh was living paycheck to paycheck?

1:24:38 Yeah, we had a couple that was making upwards of $400,000 a year,

1:24:44 but no, it was all gone.

1:24:46 Thousands of dollars a month on[ __] A house they couldn't afford.

1:24:49 Going out to eat every meal, multiple meals a day,

1:24:51 stopping at the gas station, two car loans on like 60, $70,000 cars.

1:24:57 Um, they just lifestyle inflate themselves.

1:25:00 Honestly, the people that are worse off on the show are the people that make

1:25:02 the most amount of money cuz they have access to more and more debt.

1:25:05 The lower income people on the show typically are

1:25:08 in easier to get out of positions cuz they need like

1:25:10 a a job that just pays an extra 5% more

1:25:13 and they can get out of a situation because they

1:25:16 weren't able to get into a bad enough situation where

1:25:18 the people making hundreds of thousands have gotten into so

1:25:21 much bad debt where the increase they need to get

1:25:24 out of it is literally like an extra $100,000 a year.

1:25:27 Like what's the most debt you've seen someone I don't know the actual number,

1:25:31 but it was hundreds of thousands for sure.

1:25:33 Um, I don't I don't know if we ever got up to a million.

1:25:36 We've gotten pretty damn close,

1:25:37 but usually that becomes mortgages and really large car loans and student loans.

1:25:44 Who's the youngest person who's ever come

1:25:46 on your show and how bad were their finances?

1:25:48 18, but not that bad because they didn't really have time to and it was earlier.

1:25:52 And that's why we don't really allow people that are like under 21.

1:25:55 It has to be a rare situation.

1:25:58 It's just cuz they don't really have time to[ __] it up that bad.

1:26:00 And if you do, it's usually just student loans at that point.

1:26:02 Maybe like a $250 credit card.

1:26:04 Uh, so it just really wasn't that bad cuz

1:26:06 they haven't had the opportunity to[ __] up yet.

1:26:08 Which there should probably be a show

1:26:09 for that, but I would be bored out of my mind.

1:26:11 But there should probably be a show where it's like,

1:26:13 "Hey, you might[ __] up soon.

1:26:15 Don't do it so you don't mess it up." That'd be good for people to learn,

1:26:19 but it ain't going to be me.

1:26:21 We've covered this a bit, but I kind of want to expand on it a little more.

1:26:24 like what crisis do you think Gen Z will face in the next decade?

1:26:29 The AI is a hill that we don't know

1:26:31 what the other side looks like and it is scary.

1:26:34 It could boost productivity in a way that's incredible for everyone's job.

1:26:38 It could take everyone out of job and we have no solution.

1:26:41 It could take everyone out of job and we have an incredible UBI.

1:26:45 It could destroy the world.

1:26:46 It could who knows?

1:26:48 AI is so uncertain and it's scary for Gen Z, especially generation alpha.

1:26:53 Um, yeah, I feel really bad for them with that because

1:26:56 it's hard to position what degree to get right now.

1:26:59 It's hard to position what career field to start investing

1:27:01 your time and energy into to try to move up on.

1:27:05 This is very difficult choices to make.

1:27:07 Uh, so that is one of the hardest things.

1:27:11 We are certainly headed for some kind of student

1:27:15 loan catastrophe at some point because no one's changing it.

1:27:19 No one's changing it.

1:27:20 And that that's I don't know again

1:27:26 they can get on the repayment assistance program

1:27:27 and do 1% of their income but even

1:27:29 that their balances are never going to go down.

1:27:31 It skews their debt to income ratios.

1:27:33 It just looks bad across everything.

1:27:36 Makes it harder to qualify for different types of loans.

1:27:40 Um getting cars.

1:27:41 Cars are getting more and more expensive.

1:27:43 So that is becoming a category that's very difficult to deal with.

1:27:47 Do you think we're in like a private credit bubble?

1:27:50 probably.

1:27:50 But I mean, you don't really know when you're in a bubble, right?

1:27:53 Like, we've been in this tech bubble for the last 10 years.

1:27:56 It's never burst.

1:27:57 Maybe it will, maybe it won't.

1:27:58 Maybe it's not a bubble.

1:27:59 Are we in an AI bubble?

1:28:00 I don't know.

1:28:01 Who knows?

1:28:02 I You can't It's hard to say something's

1:28:05 a bubble when you're in a bubble, right?

1:28:07 Do you think there's something you see about AI and jobs

1:28:09 or just AI in general that most people aren't thinking about?

1:28:12 No.

1:28:13 I just think more people are confident

1:28:14 than they should be on what's the outcome.

1:28:16 I don't know.

1:28:17 It could be good.

1:28:17 It could create more jobs.

1:28:18 It could create less.

1:28:19 Kevin Olirri says it's going to create more.

1:28:21 Uh I think his counterpart Mark Cuban says it's going to destroy all.

1:28:25 I could be wrong on that.

1:28:25 I think that's what he says.

1:28:27 But what does your gut tell you though?

1:28:29 No.

1:28:29 __] my gut.

1:28:30 What do you want to know about my gut?

1:28:32 My gut means nothing.

1:28:33 It doesn't matter.

1:28:35 I My Who cares?

1:28:37 Like I'm not even going to listen to my gut.

1:28:38 I don't give a[ __] Like I don't know.

1:28:42 And I shouldn't position myself as someone that thinks I know.

1:28:44 What do your actions reflect more so?

1:28:46 Well, like I said, I'm a little more anxious person,

1:28:49 so I just try to position myself in what's

1:28:51 going to last the longest before AI could take it.

1:28:54 Trades, maybe finance due to regulations

1:28:59 that teachers, healthcare, like AI has a position everywhere there.

1:29:04 Just a little less trust of a normal human

1:29:05 wanting their kindergarten teachers to be their AI, right?

1:29:10 So,

1:29:10 do you feel urgency to make money more so now than you did maybe 3 years ago?

1:29:15 No, not than three years ago now because I feel very comfortable now.

1:29:19 If every if uh if my income dried up,

1:29:21 I would I could live a very comfortable life.

1:29:23 So, I feel okay with that.

1:29:26 Um, are you investing in different places because of the AI thing?

1:29:29 Uh, well, for sure.

1:29:30 I mean, I know my stock portfolio absolutely

1:29:33 has AI in it 100% because that's a lot

1:29:36 of the top performers in the United States

1:29:38 economy right now and the stock market in general.

1:29:40 So you any index that I'm in that is

1:29:42 a top performing index has some kind of AI in it.

1:29:46 So absolutely but I don't I don't feel like a race

1:29:48 like oh my goodness AI is going to come take every job.

1:29:52 So I mean if if I'm in a blessed position man

1:29:55 I I'm lucky where I got that savings where I'm okay.

1:29:59 Do you think the average person should have that kind of anxiety that Yes.

1:30:03 You do?

1:30:04 Absolutely.

1:30:04 Cuz I'm I'm lucky enough that I'm not average, right?

1:30:07 But I've saved all my money that I've made here.

1:30:10 Um, like you said, Gen Z, $400 that they don't have $400.

1:30:15 I would feel terribly anxious.

1:30:17 3 years ago, I felt terribly anxious.

1:30:19 A year ago, maybe I was still a little anxious on it.

1:30:22 Absolutely.

1:30:22 And that's but and that's normal.

1:30:24 They're they're not wrong for fearing that anxiety.

1:30:26 The scariest stuff is what we don't know.

1:30:28 And that's the one thing that I say is we don't know where AI is going.

1:30:33 So that is very reasonable and fair anxiety, right?

1:30:38 But also people should and generally should try to make as much as they

1:30:40 can right now anyway because even

1:30:41 if everything stays normal, nothing goes wrong,

1:30:44 that allows them to invest now and even if you make less later,

1:30:47 do more passions later, you're allowing your money to grow over decades

1:30:51 in the market compounded to like 10% on average.

1:30:53 So it's but obviously just saying yeah, go make more money as Gen Z is okay.

1:30:58 but the job market and degrees and all that[ __]

1:31:01 and it makes it harder so you can't just go do it.

1:31:04 But do you think this uncertainty about the future

1:31:08 is a big cause of Jenz's financial situation?

1:31:11 Like do you think Jenz are going broke because

1:31:14 they feel like everything is hopeless in the future?

1:31:17 Like they feel like AI is going to take all of our jobs.

1:31:19 They feel like they're not going to be able to be financially free.

1:31:22 I don't know about the AI one specifically.

1:31:24 I don't remember what this term is called,

1:31:25 but there is a percentage of young people,

1:31:28 Gen Z and millennials, where they're like,

1:31:30 I'm never going to be able to get a house or retire,

1:31:31 so what does it matter anyway, so let's just blow the money and have fun.

1:31:34 Now, there's a term for that.

1:31:35 I don't remember what it is,

1:31:36 but there is a part of our culture that is pretty extreme on that end for sure.

1:31:42 Um, I don't know about that that fear

1:31:44 of AI specifically leading to the blowing money behavior,

1:31:48 but definitely on the I'm not going to own a house, so what's the point anyway?

1:31:52 Which, by the way, I know home ownership is so baked into our society.

1:31:56 I think people should just rent anyway.

1:31:58 Gives you freedom to move.

1:32:00 It gives you freedom to change jobs a little better.

1:32:03 You don't have to deal with the maintenance

1:32:04 and it's cheaper than owning a home regardless.

1:32:07 Don't don't don't chase that home ownership thing.

1:32:10 Know it's so baked into our culture.

1:32:12 Mathematically, it just doesn't make sense.

1:32:13 Invest your money.

1:32:14 It's going to make more money.

1:32:15 Stock market is going to make more money.

1:32:17 It just really does.

1:32:20 Yeah, I I largely agree on that.

1:32:22 Um, but I understand wanting to own as well.

1:32:24 It's baked into our culture.

1:32:26 What do you think is the most important job that doesn't pay well?

1:32:30 Social services.

1:32:32 It's caught up a little more.

1:32:33 It's caught up a little more, but for decades,

1:32:35 it was dramatically underpaid for the service that it provides.

1:32:39 Um, public safety is also caught up.

1:32:42 We definitely need people of public safety making money.

1:32:44 Nursing's caught up as well.

1:32:45 A lot of those have caught up.

1:32:46 Even teachers actually get paid a lot better than a lot of people think.

1:32:49 Bad school districts obviously and lower paid states, those 100% exist,

1:32:53 but that exists for all sectors in those communities.

1:32:56 Um, yeah, honestly, politicians should probably make more money.

1:33:02 I want to avoid corruption by, you know,

1:33:05 just making sure they are able to fill their pockets.

1:33:08 Like, I've heard that tape before.

1:33:09 I think it's an interesting

1:33:10 take, but like it's not even a fully well thoughtout opinion, right?

1:33:13 I'm sure there's a good counterargument,

1:33:15 but uh don't let them trade individual stocks.

1:33:17 They can only invest in American indexes.

1:33:20 Uh and try to get away from lobbying,

1:33:23 which I know the Supreme Court essentially said, "Oh, no.

1:33:25 It's totally illegal." So, okay, we're not going to get away from it,

1:33:28 I guess, cuz it's just constitutional.

1:33:30 So, pay them enough money where it's like to try to lower corruption,

1:33:34 but even if you pay them more money, would they not want more money anyway?

1:33:38 So, I don't know.

1:33:38 But maybe that's one position we could make even higher.

1:33:41 We want people People want to make a lot

1:33:44 of a lot of ambitious people want to make good money.

1:33:47 So, let's have good people want to run for public office as well.

1:33:50 Maybe that's another reason why public office should make more money.

1:33:52 Someone could be a CEO somewhere, but maybe that person would be able to deliver

1:33:55 more of a public good by running for public office.

1:33:57 Maybe a good person could be president that's

1:33:59 never going to run because they know they're

1:34:00 not going to make much money being president

1:34:02 until afterwards when they do a book deal.

1:34:04 So, yeah, maybe that could be an argument for it.

1:34:07 Do 911 dispatchers make a lot of money?

1:34:10 Uh, we've had two on our show that don't.

1:34:12 They don't make Yeah, that's definitely one that could make more money for sure,

1:34:16 but it definitely seems to be a lower skill job in that marketplace, right?

1:34:20 It's like it's someone we definitely depend on and we need,

1:34:23 but they tend to hire lowqualified people that How much do they get paid?

1:34:29 Depends where, but I think we had someone

1:34:30 she was close to like 20 bucks an hour,

1:34:32 but she was in a lower cost she was in a lower cost of living area as well.

1:34:36 Like she wasn't That's even worse.

1:34:38 If she budgeted properly,

1:34:40 she could have actually done pretty okay on her income situation.

1:34:44 That's insane.

1:34:44 Yeah.

1:34:45 You I mean, if you ever have to call 911 in LA,

1:34:47 you can't even get them to pick up usually cuz it's just so far.

1:34:50 Well, I'm not surprised.

1:34:51 Who would work in public safety in LA, right?

1:34:54 It's like they're not really morally supported.

1:34:57 This is a weird one,

1:34:59 but do you think money problems come from spiritual problems?

1:35:03 I mean, the tithing thing, right?

1:35:05 Can you define tithing for me?

1:35:06 It's where you have to give like

1:35:07 a certain percentage of your income no matter what.

1:35:10 10%.

1:35:10 Okay.

1:35:10 Gotcha.

1:35:10 It's like if you do that even when you're

1:35:12 in a bad financial position and you can't afford that extra 10%.

1:35:14 Yeah.

1:35:15 That can[ __] you.

1:35:16 That can[ __] you.

1:35:17 Absolutely.

1:35:18 Spiritual perspective.

1:35:19 I don't know.

1:35:21 I mean often times religious people tend to be religious young people

1:35:28 tend to be more social because young people are really antisocial right now.

1:35:31 So that tends to be one of the only places

1:35:33 of community which usually leads to better outcomes in general.

1:35:37 If you have a good social life,

1:35:38 you tend to have good job, good income, good career, good family life.

1:35:43 So there's lots of benefits to religion in our current we've lost third places,

1:35:52 places where people would go and hang out.

1:35:54 um especially like men's spaces,

1:35:56 they've completely vanished and guys are pathetically lonely and they

1:36:01 need to sometimes church is a good place to them.

1:36:04 So religious religion can help them in that regard in terms of hurting them.

1:36:08 Yeah, the tithing thing can hurt them.

1:36:11 Or if they're like, "Oh,

1:36:12 I'm going to go on a mission trip for two months and quit my job." Yeah,

1:36:14 that I mean that's[ __][ __] Don't do that.

1:36:16 That makes no sense.

1:36:17 You can't afford that.

1:36:18 You need to work your job.

1:36:20 Um it depends.

1:36:22 I don't know.

1:36:23 That's interesting though.

1:36:24 So you think a core psychological reason is the lack of connection leads to

1:36:29 Well, I don't know.

1:36:29 I'm just saying religion could be good in that regard, right?

1:36:32 If your religion is having you flying a plane into a building, not the best.

1:36:37 That is a good financial choice though cuz

1:36:39 then you don't have to save for retirement.

1:36:40 So it works.

1:36:44 It works.

1:36:45 But I [laughter] I guess the like connection portion like would you guess

1:36:49 that the more lonely people feel the more uh money problems they have?

1:36:54 Oh, I wouldn't be surprised.

1:36:55 It's the O of spending, Uber Eats, all this[ __] Absolutely.

1:37:00 Yeah, certainly paying a lot for video games and

1:37:03 like what emotion causes people to spend in your view?

1:37:05 Do you think it's like trying to fill

1:37:07 like a void for happiness usually like overspending?

1:37:10 Yeah, it's a few different things.

1:37:11 It is that chase of dopamine.

1:37:12 Sometimes it is looking good.

1:37:14 It's, you know, you want to look good on at the stoplight uh or being perceived.

1:37:19 Some of it is showing off on social media.

1:37:21 Some is coping for a reasonable trauma.

1:37:23 Some is coping for a[ __] trauma where

1:37:25 people use trauma as a cope where it's like,

1:37:27 okay, yeah, someone called you a bad word once.

1:37:29 Oh, no, you're fine.

1:37:30 Where some people have like actual like

1:37:33 generational like abuse or something and yeah, that is sometimes a cope.

1:37:36 Some people have mental health problems where that's their cope.

1:37:39 They feel depressed.

1:37:40 They door dash something.

1:37:41 and it makes them feel better, but then you'll feel bad after 20 minutes anyway.

1:37:44 So, uh yeah, absolutely.

1:37:46 Either trying to feel good or you feel down.

1:37:49 It is spending money.

1:37:52 There is a reward there in your brain that feels good to get that food,

1:37:56 to get that gift, to do something.

1:37:58 Even when you're giving something to someone,

1:37:59 it's still selfish because you're doing it

1:38:01 because it feels good to give something.

1:38:03 So, absolutely.

1:38:04 So, the worse you feel, the easier it is to fall in those cope

1:38:07 cycles of just spending money to feel good.

1:38:09 H I guess in your situation um and I'll

1:38:15 ask you more about it like the specifics,

1:38:17 but would you say that when you were in debt uh it was kind of like

1:38:24 self-love helped me become financially free or like

1:38:27 doing the actions made me love myself more?

1:38:29 Does that kind of make sense?

1:38:32 Like do you think it was happiness first

1:38:34 or do you think it was the actions first?

1:38:35 I don't think I was ever unhappy really.

1:38:37 No, I don't think so.

1:38:38 We all have unhappy moments, but I think my general contentness with just

1:38:43 in general where I am is pretty flat.

1:38:45 But I think I adapt to things pretty quickly.

1:38:48 Like if I when I was poor as[ __] I was happy.

1:38:51 Yeah, that's that's my reality.

1:38:53 You seem like a very happy person.

1:38:56 Well, in general, I mean, we all have down moments and that's fine.

1:38:58 Like I'll have like a down day.

1:39:00 Um I don't know.

1:39:03 You adjust to everything pretty quickly.

1:39:05 I think I I don't remember who said it or what, whatever,

1:39:08 but it was like you can adjust to any

1:39:11 lifestyle within 3 months and then that's your baseline,

1:39:14 you know, that's your new baseline.

1:39:16 So, no, it it was all behavior.

1:39:19 It was just it was wanting better for myself.

1:39:21 But even when I get got there, like, yeah,

1:39:24 I'm sure there was a when I got my first house well before I started YouTube,

1:39:27 I was like, "Yeah, but like you adjust.

1:39:28 That's your normal life.

1:39:30 That's your normal life.

1:39:31 I became a millionaire, but that's your normal life.

1:39:34 It's like I I remember um I know people are just like,

1:39:39 "Oh, you know, you're wealthy.

1:39:40 You're out of touch and all this stuff."

1:39:41 But I the vast majority of my life was poor.

1:39:44 I was poor.

1:39:44 I grew up, you know, lower middle class foreclosure notices.

1:39:48 When I was born, my dad was a gas station attendant.

1:39:50 My mom worked front desk at a eye place, you know, we didn't make money.

1:39:55 Uh I remember dreaming of like, oh my goodness,

1:39:59 if I was a millionaire, my life would change.

1:40:01 Changed for a second.

1:40:01 And I was happy that I hit the goal, but my level of happiness did not change.

1:40:05 It really didn't.

1:40:07 Now, it gives you more access to things.

1:40:09 If there were health complications, I can get my life saved a bit easier.

1:40:12 It absolutely does that.

1:40:13 So, I'm not saying rich isn't better.

1:40:15 Don't don't get me wrong on that argument.

1:40:16 But my level of I didn't sacrifice because it made my life happier.

1:40:22 I I think I always chase that better

1:40:25 and better and better because it's fun to chase.

1:40:28 I'm ambitious and uh you think you'll be

1:40:30 happier when you hit it, but you hit it.

1:40:32 When you're happy for a second, you celebrate and then you keep going.

1:40:35 Do you think there's any habits uh that you've taken on maybe from your parents

1:40:39 or just like early in your childhood that led

1:40:41 you to be like a consistently like self-loving, happy with yourself person?

1:40:46 Yeah.

1:40:46 Entrepreneurial I would say.

1:40:47 Oh, self consistently self- love.

1:40:49 What is the self- love?

1:40:50 I guess like maybe like do you always prioritize

1:40:52 spending lots of time with other people like that kind of thing?

1:40:56 No, I um I'll be honest, this question does not resonate with me.

1:41:00 [laughter] The self-loving, I do not think about it.

1:41:04 Interesting.

1:41:03 I I've not thought about it once in my life.

1:41:06 Yeah.

1:41:05 This is the first time I've ever thought about it.

1:41:08 That's fair.

1:41:09 Yeah.

1:41:09 Usually the people who I think like most confident in themselves,

1:41:12 uh treat themselves well, don't ever think about it.

1:41:15 So, it adds up to me at least.

1:41:17 But, um I try to take care of my mental health,

1:41:19 but I never think of like this self-love thing, right?

1:41:23 It's kind of just the concept of like uh you can't pour from an empty cup.

1:41:27 Uh like people are buying things to kind of fill

1:41:30 this void of like they feel as though they're not enough.

1:41:33 But like you to me seem like someone who doesn't

1:41:35 feel like they're worth more because you bought a labu,

1:41:39 you know, but I think that's usually

1:41:40 the mindset of a lot of people who overspend.

1:41:42 Um no, I I don't think so.

1:41:45 You don't think so?

1:41:47 No, for me like Yeah, I definitely don't think I do that.

1:41:49 Yeah, I think for other people for sure.

1:41:51 I don't think I'm like special in that regard either.

1:41:53 Do you compare yourself to others?

1:41:58 Maybe maybe on certain accomplishments, right?

1:42:03 [laughter] I remember uh uh one of my first

1:42:07 interactions with like another podcast or something

1:42:09 was Tony Hinchcliffe of Kill Tony and I

1:42:11 had just an awkward interaction with him.

1:42:13 It was mostly because of my autistic friend, I'll be honest.

1:42:15 But um Oh my goodness, this is so[ __] stupid.

1:42:18 Oh my gosh.

1:42:19 We So we had I don't know if we still do,

1:42:22 but we had more subscribers than him and we

1:42:24 went to the Kill Tony afterparty after one

1:42:26 of his shows and um I was just like I was a little anxious to go up to him.

1:42:30 I'm a little socially awkward, whatever.

1:42:31 And I went up to him and I was like, "Hey,

1:42:33 uh nice to meet you all this stuff." Then my friend,

1:42:35 my very autistic, why did I bring him friend came up and he was like,

1:42:38 "You know, Caleb has more subscribers than you." [laughter] I was like,

1:42:41 "You[ __] You absolute." And then like and then he

1:42:45 just started kind of like dissing us and it was fair.

1:42:47 It wasn't fair.

1:42:47 But I remember after that I was a little competitive.

1:42:49 I was like, I want to beat him on the spot podcast charts.

1:42:51 So the first time we bought beat him on the podcast charts, I was like, gotcha.

1:42:55 Um, so I mean I think he usually places above us on YouTube,

1:42:58 but I remember when we beat him and it was like it was so that was fun.

1:43:01 Um, so that made me competitive.

1:43:03 I think actually no, I don't really compare myself to people too much.

1:43:08 Uh, but usually it's like doubt of me

1:43:10 makes me do whatever it takes to do something, right?

1:43:13 Like that gets me places.

1:43:15 That[ __] that fuels me to want to accomplish something.

1:43:20 Yeah.

1:43:19 What does your comment section look like in general?

1:43:22 And uh like what is the comment section look like of someone who's not in debt?

1:43:28 Well, it's usually kind of roasty.

1:43:30 Like the same kind of roast that I'm giving like, "Oh my gosh,

1:43:32 I can't believe this situation that happened

1:43:34 in this episode." It's rarely about me.

1:43:36 What do you think people misunderstand most about you?

1:43:39 About me?

1:43:40 I mean, I I since I am very roasty, lots of jokes,

1:43:45 lots of gooning and gaffs and hard things on the gas,

1:43:48 I I care about them more than I think you would traditionally think.

1:43:52 But I've honestly I struggle in my life

1:43:54 in general in terms of like either friends or family.

1:43:57 I'm not the best at showing on the front end how I feel on the back end.

1:44:03 I'm I'm a little little more I'm not like hard

1:44:08 but maybe I'm more reserved and cold and and showing that emotion.

1:44:12 Uh but I really care about their success.

1:44:14 We track their success a lot.

1:44:16 We try to give them everything we can give them.

1:44:18 Anything they request that we don't even automatically provide.

1:44:21 We try try our best to do it.

1:44:23 I really really do care about their success.

1:44:26 Like the show wouldn't be anything without them.

1:44:30 So I want them to do well.

1:44:31 you know, pretend like I didn't even care about them from a human perspective.

1:44:34 Like, I want them to do well because

1:44:36 they're helping fund this whole thing as well.

1:44:38 Like that we would we wouldn't be anywhere without the guests on the show.

1:44:41 So, I I care about them more than I think people would think because I'm very,

1:44:46 you know, about it on the show.

1:44:49 Have you ever had someone come back on the show or get

1:44:52 in touch with you later and kind of turn their life around?

1:44:56 Oh, every day we have two uh follow-ups in our Hammer Elite membership a week.

1:45:01 So, uh in that membership uh we do three

1:45:05 premium shows every single day, six days a week.

1:45:07 In one of those that we post two episodes a week is audit update.

1:45:12 So, they come on and we get like a 20

1:45:14 minutes how they've been doing and most people change.

1:45:17 Uh it's our current tally we do an annual survey is over $20,000 of bad

1:45:23 debt paid off in 12 months or sorry I think that's the No, that's the average.

1:45:26 Yeah.

1:45:27 Was there anyone that surprised you that they got out of debt?

1:45:30 Yeah, it was our biggest episode in what we called

1:45:34 fat stack week which was like just lots of paperwork.

1:45:36 They've gone completely debtree.

1:45:38 Um Sam and Rosa are their fake names.

1:45:40 Everyone uses fake names on the show.

1:45:42 They've completely paid off their debt and they had some

1:45:44 of the highest debt that we've had on the show.

1:45:46 It was impressive.

1:45:47 They They were awesome.

1:45:49 You studied music composition.

1:45:51 Yes.

1:45:51 Building arrangements, controlling tempo,

1:45:53 knowing when to go loud, when to pull back.

1:45:56 Do you use any of that when you're making content?

1:45:59 I think it's easier to make a show [sighs and gasps]

1:46:03 and do content if you're if you like entertaining people.

1:46:09 So, I like making an entertaining product.

1:46:11 I like making music not just for me to listen

1:46:14 to, but because I wanted other people to think, "Oh,

1:46:16 that's the coolest piece of music I heard in this concert." You know,

1:46:18 I want I I like to entertain.

1:46:20 I want people to get joy in consuming whatever I am making.

1:46:23 If I was making if I owned a coffee shop, I would want it to be the best coffee.

1:46:26 You know, the I always want to just deliver what the consumer wants.

1:46:31 So, absolutely.

1:46:32 I think how that translated from making music to making videos is absolutely

1:46:38 just learning what people like and making sure I they they are my customer

1:46:43 and I want to deliver that.

1:46:44 Do you think of like uh composing a song

1:46:47 similarly at all to like making an episode?

1:46:50 Because I I know something that you do that I see at least is

1:46:54 like it's very good like rhythm and like ups and downs like highs and lows.

1:46:59 Yeah, it's a different art in terms of what goes into a piece of music.

1:47:01 But yeah, I mean if you if you learn

1:47:03 pacing of music um you can apply similar logic to video.

1:47:10 It's completely different pacing and how you want to structure a video.

1:47:13 But if you at least know how to do one,

1:47:14 you might be able to do the other a bit easier.

1:47:18 So just that art artistic instinct into what you're creating.

1:47:22 I guess we kind of covered it a bit,

1:47:24 but what's the most important part of your backstory to understand why

1:47:28 you care so much about people getting out of debt and saving money?

1:47:32 Like uh what is that and how did you turn it around?

1:47:36 Yeah, it was two things.

1:47:37 it was growing up in that from poor and lower middle class foreclosure notices.

1:47:42 Um, and just making sure I didn't want to go through

1:47:44 that again in my life and if I have a family,

1:47:46 I don't want them to go through it.

1:47:47 That and then when I was in my own

1:47:50 personal really bad debt from public student loans,

1:47:52 federal student loans, family debt, car loans, maxed out credit cards,

1:47:56 and just how damaging that was for my life.

1:47:58 I couldn't necessarily I did actually pretty well as a self-employed composer.

1:48:02 Um, but having all that debt and those minimum

1:48:04 monthly payments were risk over my head

1:48:06 that were holding me back from able to go

1:48:08 full-time on that like the way I wanted to.

1:48:11 So, it just held me back.

1:48:12 So, my debt payoff journey was a step to being able to pursue that.

1:48:17 But then it my priorities changed,

1:48:19 became a step to having a fully funed emergency fund as well,

1:48:21 a step to getting my first house,

1:48:23 you know, a couple years before starting YouTube.

1:48:25 Um, and then accumulating a quart million dollar

1:48:28 net worth before I ever made a YouTube video.

1:48:30 So just that life experience of going through what the people on the show have

1:48:34 been through for the most part is

1:48:37 it's better than someone who grew up privileged,

1:48:39 who grew up rich, who've never had debt,

1:48:40 never had to work for it, never had to do that sacrifice.

1:48:43 I've actually been on the other side of the table.

1:48:45 And even with the roasts and jabs and silliness that come with the show,

1:48:48 it's still the kind of conversation and system that I needed

1:48:52 and wish I had when I was a dumbass 22-year-old destroying my life.

1:48:56 Yeah.

1:48:57 Yeah.

1:48:57 And that my parents should have had when I was being born,

1:49:00 you know, when they were 19 and 20 or 18 and 19.

1:49:03 I guess if I'm someone who wants to spend 30% less money over the next 6 months,

1:49:08 what exact steps should I take to do so?

1:49:11 First, download Dollarise, shameless plug, but it's honestly true.

1:49:14 Like, okay, dollar or not, a budgeting app.

1:49:17 Okay, I obviously advocate for it.

1:49:19 We build it specifically to make it easier

1:49:20 for the average person to use, but whatever.

1:49:22 A budgeting app cuz it's automatic actions.

1:49:25 You need to see where your money's going.

1:49:27 If you don't know where your money is going on percentage,

1:49:29 categories, individual purchases, you'll never be able to make any progress.

1:49:32 If you don't do that, there's no other

1:49:34 parts of this conversation that can be done.

1:49:36 So, you have to start with figuring out where your money is going.

1:49:38 The budgeting apps are the best way to do it.

1:49:40 Preferably don't always,

1:49:41 but you start there and then it's actually deciding what level first of all,

1:49:48 what's needs, what's wants,

1:49:50 what's investing of any kind that you're saving for a car or whatever.

1:49:53 Then of your wants, what actual level of joy is this doing?

1:49:58 And that's one thing that we do unique in particular is you you

1:50:01 decide you give it a level of joy that it's actually providing to you.

1:50:05 So you know, it's easier to cut the things that do not actually provide you joy,

1:50:08 but you just find yourself doing.

1:50:10 So, it's easier to cut down on your wants

1:50:13 to be able to redistribute those to either

1:50:15 to needs if you need to stress your needs more or to up your investments,

1:50:18 whether that's, hey, I need to get a new car or I need to fully

1:50:21 fund my emergency fund or um obviously save more for retirement.

1:50:26 So, in order to cut 30%,

1:50:28 it's really it's not a three-step process, it's a one-step process.

1:50:33 Just use a budgeting app.

1:50:34 People just aren't using these tools that are

1:50:36 the most incredible things in modern history for personal finance.

1:50:40 And I have no idea why.

1:50:41 How much money are people spending on things that don't make them happy?

1:50:46 Oh, hundreds, if not thousands of dollars.

1:50:48 It's just little things.

1:50:50 It's little things that they don't even know

1:50:52 that they think make them happy maybe in the moment,

1:50:54 but overall don't contribute to their happiness.

1:50:56 It really doesn't long term.

1:50:57 It gives them like a minute, a minute, two minutes.